What is NOT a classical education?

[Jennefer@SSA]

Originally Posted by arcticmom

Jennifer and KrissiK, although given our own backgrounds which may pale in comparison to the education we want for our children, what we are giving them is far more than they would get in ps. Just remember that as you "keep on keeping on". Their exposure to a far greater range of knowledge will whet their appetites to learn more - if not now, once they are older (I hope!). Hopefully we are giving them the tools they need to be great self-teachers, so that someday if they want to read TWEM it won't be so hard.

Thanks for the encouragement. I thought about exactly what you said after I typed my response. My frustration is I don't want better for my kids; I want the best. Yet, thanks for your kind words.

[stripe]

Thought this article might interest you, although it is from a Charlotte Mason perspective:

Do Electricians Need Shakespeare? by Jennifer Spencer

http://childlightusa.wordpress.com/

[Jami]

I like this comparison chart:

http://wamemphis.com/educationalcomparison

[Sahamamama]

Originally Posted by KrissiK

This is a great thread and it makes me want even more to give my kids a classical education - so they learn to think. My frustration is that I had a horrible (though not uncommon) education. What I mean by that is, the schools I went to were "good" schools, but I was not challenged or even taught to value or love education. I skated through private high school, never read any of the "great" books. We were taught them, but I read enough of them to pass the test. And now, I'm 42 years old, I attempted to "re-educate" myself using "The Well-Educated Mind" and read through the first half of "Don Quixote" 4 times and then quit. That was when I was actually able to stay awake during my kids' naptime (which is the only quiet time of the day), because I would generally pick up DQ, read for 5 minutes and then fall asleep. I see the value, and especially reading the replies to this thread, what I want for my children's education, I"m just not sure I'm capable of giving it to them.

Then give them what you can. You say that even the private school didn't challenge you, so if you challenge yourself now, and do your best to challenge your children as they grow, then you'll be doing better than an unchallenging private or public school. You can do this!

[Hotdrink]

You probably need to distinguish between a traditional classical education, a neo-classical education, and a WTM education (remember, as much as we love it, TWTM isn't the be-all and end-all of classical education, it's just one version!).

ETA - oops, somebody already said that.

[Sahamamama]

Originally Posted by Jennefer@SSA

By the way, if I just read one other book on Classical Education to expand my horizons, what would it be in your opinion?

Norms and Nobility, by David V. Hicks.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/076...cm_rdp_product

[Sahamamama]

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/our-model/

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/a-cla...ch-to-history/

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/the-j...cal-education/

Another POV:

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...e-Simmons.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...knowledge.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...nological.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...logically.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...ckHistory.html

And:

http://www.classical-homeschooling.org/index.html

And:

http://www.triviumpursuit.com/

And:

http://latincentered.com/

[HSLover]

Originally Posted by Charles Wallace

Classical Education is Not...
1. Unschooling
Unschooling is basically the antithesis of classical education.

2. "Unit studies"
This particuarly applies to unit studies that do not proceed according to a logical sequence. That is, a "unit" in a unit study might be about (let's say) bats, so you might study bats, read Stellaluna, build a bat house, etc., and then move on to geodes, but there would not be a logical reason WHY you moved from bats to geodes...nor why (from there) you would go on to seaweed, for example.

By contrast, classical education fundamentally relies on there being a coherent and logical sequence, usually chronological, driving the curriculum and its choices. Thus, a classical educator might study amoebae before bats (moving from simple to complex organisms, for example). In short, there would be a logical principle behind the sequence.

3. Culture (and Curriculum) of Narcissism
For example, in the public school district for which we are zoned, students learn "My Neighborhood" and "My City" and "My State" first and foremost, spending (IMHO) an inordinate amount of time on these things. In this view, one's own experience and house/neighborhood/group are the center of the universe -- other irrelevancies like Rome or Thomas Jefferson or Galileo fade into the background.

Classical education seeks to put things in a coherent story or order. Students learning history learn about it from the beginning -- whether that be the founding of human civilization and the start of written historical chronicles, or the beginning of human life. They learn about it in order, and THEN they are able to see how "my neighborhood" relates to the rest of the world and have these concepts in an appropriate perspective. They see how ancient Greece influenced the republic of Rome, which influenced the development of the United States, which influenced the history of one's own state (and the place of "My Neighborhood") in it. They learn the development of many cultures and thus learn where My Family or My Ethnic Group or My Race fits into the larger story that's been going on since the beginning of the universe.

Think about it this way: Our public school, and others like it, starts with a teeny little radius and expands that radius -- that is, from the self to the family to the neighborhood to the state. Classical education starts with a wide radius and moves to a smaller one: the world to the civilization to the country to the state to the self.

4. Grammar: What are that?
Most classical educators stress the necessity for a solid foundation in the "grammar" of a discipline. For mathematics, this would mean a solid mastery in the four fundamental operations. For English, this would mean a solid understanding of the parts of speech, the parts of a sentence, the organization of a paragraph and essay, the types of rhetorical tropes, and so on. Any system of education that condemns these skills as "just rote memorization" is not classical.

That's not all-inclusive, but it's a start. Hope that helps!

WoW!!! Excellent, Love it!

Originally Posted by Sahamamama

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/our-model/

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/classical-education/

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/a-cla...ch-to-history/

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/the-j...cal-education/

Another POV:

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...e-Simmons.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...knowledge.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...nological.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...logically.html

http://www.memoriapress.com/articles...ckHistory.html

And:

http://www.classical-homeschooling.org/index.html

And:

http://www.triviumpursuit.com/

And:

http://latincentered.com/

I am going to be up until o'dark thurty now! tyvm

[angela in ohio]

Originally Posted by 8FillTheHeart

Sorry......but I disagree about cyclical history as a determinant for classical education.

While there are numerous definitions of neo-classical philosophy, the main components of traditional classical education are logical argument and rhetorical analysis.

In my opinion, excerpt studies of literature and history would be examples of non-classical education. Worksheet/multiple choice education would also be examples.

Classical education should focus on original works and classical literature. Understanding the importance of the structure of language and using that ability to argue persuasively are fundamental. The ultimate goal of CE should be the formation of independent thinkers who are effective communicators. Those goals require dialogue, original thinking, and defending the position.

[cajun.classical]

Originally Posted by Jami

I like this comparison chart:

http://wamemphis.com/educationalcomparison