What pre-reqs for starting Miquon or RightStart A?

[forty-two]

Right now my dd (almost 3) knows her numbers 1-10 (points them out *everywhere* and likes me to write them for her) and can count objects up to ten reasonably well, although she sometimes skips a number to get to a favorite one faster :tongue_smilie:. She really likes counting, and we can get her to eat less favorite foods by counting bites - she will sometimes even keep going beyond the "required" number :tongue_smilie:.

So far we have just been "doing math" by reading her numbers book and counting lots of stuff (and sorting silverware and whatnot). While I don't really want to introduce anything too formal anytime soon (certainly no workbooks), I don't want to hold her back. As well, I'm trying to become more intentional about introducing her to new topics, games, etc., now that she is nearing three. But I have no idea what comes between counting and addition, with respect to how children learn. Her numbers book has add/sub problems in the back, but we just count the pictures in each group - she has no interest in putting the groups together.

My questions:
*Is being able to count but not "getting" adding just a maturity thing, or is there also a conceptual step missing b/w counting and adding?
*What does she need to be able to do/know to start something like Miquon or RS A/Activities for the Al Abacus?
*Also, would the RS math card games book be useful now? (She can kinda play Uno: has her numbers down cold but is still shaky on colors.)

TIA

[Amber in AUS]

No advice but bumping bc i would love to see some answers. I am looking as RS A for my DS, he is about the same place as your DC.

[Geo]

No pre-requisite for RS A, which is Kindergarten. Don't practice counting as a skill beforehand, that isn't encouraged by the author. It uses the asian approach to math and starts with seeing quantities in small groups.

For Miquon, knowing numbers 0-10 or even higher, since it is considered a first grade book by the author. Don't let that cause you to question it's quality. It moves quickly and is very effective.

I've used both and both are excellent. In My opinion, Miquon is more exciting because of the discovery method of learning. Either way, I'd take a leisurely pace, she is very young.
Geo

[HiddenJewel]

I really like how RightStart presents concepts. It starts from ground zero. If you are planning on going the RS direction, I would highly encourage you to get the Level A TM and read through it. It is definitely different than normal math programs, and it is best if you start the student on it from the beginning instead of having to reteach the concepts. And the math games are great.

I do like Miquon too.

[Geo]

hiccup

[Tabrett]

I think a good pre-requisite for RS would be- show her certain amounts on your fingers and have her tell you how many you are showing her, without counting.

For example. Show her 5 fingers and she responds with five and doesn't count your fingers. Do this with 1-10. That was the hardest concept for my dd (my 3yo son can do it easier than my 5yo:glare:).

Recognizing quantities of numbers between 1-10, without counting, is one of the biggest concepts RS requires you child to be able to do.

RS wants you to be able to visualize numbers in your head.

[3blessingmom]

I started young with my ds who is now 6. I kept it VERY informal.

This is super easy and pays off big dividends: Set Cuisenairre rods out on the table in front of dc and busy yourself 2 ft away. That's all.:D Watch that the rods aren't thrown, pushed off the table, eaten, etc.... (put them away immediatly if missused!) and let her build trains and houses, etc,e tc.....in time she will intuitively *know* that "one light green and one red=yellow"....which easily translates to 3+2=5 when she's ready to work with numerals.

Instead of counting, I would play matching games. Match 3 dots to 3 dots, and then 3 dots to the numeral 3. This teaches her to know 3 when she sees it, rather than counting.

A MUST read book for that age: http://www.amazon.com/Richard-Scarrys-Best-Counting-Book/dp/0394829247 (LOL - I was copying this link for you, and my ds2 saw the cover of the book and said "meeeeese mommy, read it read it!!!"....:lol:)

[brehon]

Right now my dd (almost 3) knows her numbers 1-10 (points them out *everywhere* and likes me to write them for her) and can count objects up to ten reasonably well, although she sometimes skips a number to get to a favorite one faster :tongue_smilie:. She really likes counting, and we can get her to eat less favorite foods by counting bites - she will sometimes even keep going beyond the "required" number :tongue_smilie:.

So far we have just been "doing math" by reading her numbers book and counting lots of stuff (and sorting silverware and whatnot). While I don't really want to introduce anything too formal anytime soon (certainly no workbooks), I don't want to hold her back. As well, I'm trying to become more intentional about introducing her to new topics, games, etc., now that she is nearing three. But I have no idea what comes between counting and addition, with respect to how children learn. Her numbers book has add/sub problems in the back, but we just count the pictures in each group - she has no interest in putting the groups together.

My questions:
*Is being able to count but not "getting" adding just a maturity thing, or is there also a conceptual step missing b/w counting and adding?

Yes, I think it's pretty much a matter of maturity. The conceptual step involved (part + part = whole) really does involve a level of maturity most 2 yo/3 yo's don't yet have.

*What does she need to be able to do/know to start something like Miquon or RS A/Activities for the Al Abacus?

As another poster mentioned RS emphasizes grouping numbers rather than counting. Kids learn to visualize 5 using the abacus and other teaching aids (bead cards, fingers, tally sticks). The games for RS stress and build on this foundation. So, your dd would need to understand, for example, what a group of 5 looks like. I've never used Miquon so can't comment on the program.

*Also, would the RS math card games book be useful now? (She can kinda play Uno: has her numbers down cold but is still shaky on colors.)

See above.

TIA


I know you want to meet your dd where she is (and, who knows, maybe you have a math genius on your hands). Two and three year olds rarely have the ability to sit through any sort of "lessons", no matter how informal they may be. I think, however, there are other things you can do to help your dd prepare for the time you do formal math. Puzzles, tangrams, legos/wedgits, building blocks, imaginative play, and, of course, lots of reading aloud to her are some of the best preparation for "school" I know. I'm not saying that you don't do those things already; I just want you to think about activities other than schoolish ones. And do get RS A (if you think that's the program you'll want to use with your dd), read it through, and understand her philosophy. Also, check out Liping Ma's Knowing and Understanding Elementary Mathematics for more info on the "Asian" system of teaching math. I wouldn't start RS A with a 3 yo (*maybe* a late 4yo depending on the child's maturity level). I started RS with my dd after she turned 5. And I've used some of the concepts taught in RS with my ds(almost 8) -- he uses Singapore Math.

[Mommy22alyns]

I think a good pre-requisite for RS would be- show her certain amounts on your fingers and have her tell you how many you are showing her, without counting.

For example. Show her 5 fingers and she responds with five and doesn't count your fingers. Do this with 1-10. That was the hardest concept for my dd (my 3yo son can do it easier than my 5yo:glare:).

Recognizing quantities of numbers between 1-10, without counting, is one of the biggest concepts RS requires you child to be able to do.

RS wants you to be able to visualize numbers in your head.



:iagree: You could even get the RS music for Yellow is the Sun and practice singing that while showing the numbers on fingers.

I wouldn't start RS A with my child that young, but we're not math geniuses here either. :D Sylvia did just turn 4 and she likes to sit in on the lessons sometimes. She can sing Yellow is the Sun and play some of the most basic games like finding the missing number in a line of cards 0-10.

If she has her numbers down, how about playing Go Fish? Sylvia loves Go Fish.

[LadyAberlin]

I'm about to purchase this book http://www.amazon.com/Dr-Wrights-Kitchen-Table-Math/dp/1934124036/ref=pd_bbs_sr_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1240082945&sr=8-1 It is recommended by the art of problem solving people at www.artofproblemsolving.com. It is for ages 2-8.

[Ellie]

Miquon assumes that the dc are already familiar with Cuinsenaire rods, although many folks jump right in there and the dc seem to be fine. :-)

My favorite product for dc who are 4 or 5 is Mathematics Made Meaningful (http://www.etacuisenaire.com/catalog/product?deptId=CUISENAIRERODS&prodId=020011&parentId=MATH). Before then, I would probably not do anything formal, other than the kinds of things mothers naturally do with their dc anyway. :-)

[forty-two]

Thanks for all the good suggestions of things to do and books to buy (my Amazon cart keeps growing and growing :tongue_smilie:). I have *no* interest in doing a formal program right now - can't even imagine how I'd get dd to do anything like that - but I do want to continue to do informal stuff. Just was at a loss for the sort of things that came after basic counting but before adding. But now I have several things to try - I'm excited!

[Spy Car]

Miquon would have basically no prerequisites.

This program assumes you will start with some Cuisenaire Rod play. So you may make some "stairs" (one thru ten values) and "trains" (where you stack the same value in different ways, using different combinations of rods). And let the kids get used to the rods. But there is a lot of reinforcement with-in the lab pages.

But, at least in my experience, my son "got" the values in no time.

I do believe a parent reading the 3 teachers books is an import step that is often missed. Often "Lab Annotations" is the only teacher book people get, and IMO they miss out if the don't also get (and read) the "First Grade Diary". At least for me, these "turned on light" for me not unlike the light I hope to turn on with my son.

These materials got me in the spirit of improvisation. I think I made at least as many of my own lab sheets as we've used in the "official" series. Not because theirs are lacking (they are not) but because it is in the spirit of the program.

And I've loved it when my son has made his own sheets.

Anyway, to make a long story short(er) the biggest prerequisite for Miquon (IMO) is a parent letting their guard down, getting past the moment when they open the Orange book to page one, see a bunch of strange shapes, and think: I can't do this.

When, in fact, you can!

One the Miquon way snaps in, it all makes sense.

Bill