Center for Talent Development--Gifted Learning Links

[Ida]

Has anyone actually done any of the online honors classes offered by Northwestern's CTD? After receiving my 6th grader's EXPLORE results, we are considering trying one, but it is an awful lot of money and I'm having trouble finding unbiased reviews from people that have actually done the program. I'd love to hear about the experiences of anyone whose tried one of these classes. Thanks, Ida

[Colleen in SEVA]

:lurk5:

I believe this is the program that MCT teaches classes through. We have not tried any online classes, but this is one that I have on my "things to consider in the future" list.

[MBM]

Which course? IP math?

[MBM]

Okay, I see what you're talking about now. Here are my two cents of advice: I would want to know what they use to teach and who is teaching and grading. Some of the instructors have more experience than others.

My daughter taught a few classes for the Saturday Enrichment Program while she was at NU. She was told what the class would be about and then had to put the material together herself in a short period of time. (We used suggestions from the WTM to do this, btw!) It was frustrating for her because she didn't receive much advice or oversight. The classes she designed turned out fine, but personally, I wouldn't want to shell out the money for a class that was cobbled together like that. So, caveat emptor. Just make sure the class is well-designed and solid. Most of them are.

A few of the classes look very good, and I think your child could get a lot out of them.

http://www.ctd.northwestern.edu/gll/program/academics/courses/enrichment/courses/

[Ida]

so I am very aware of the lack of uniformity in quality. Many teachers were fabulous and inovative teachers, and others were really struggling to tread water. The advertising is so slick though that I've got to keep reminding myself of that (and reminders from others are great too!). It's a ton of money to gamble on an opportunity that could be amazing but could also be just so-so. Ds is particularly interested in the Honors International Relations and Conflict in the 20th and 21st Century class. It sounds like a great and very relevant topic with lots of potential to be a fabulous class. I really wish I could hear from a real life-not a testimonial on their website-user.

If we end up homeschooling through high school I would also consider their AP classes.

Thanks for responses so far.

[Catwoman]

Has anyone used any of the courses for grades 3-5?

A few of the classes sound interesting, but I'm not sure if they would benefit my ds enough to make it worth spending that much money on a single class. If he were in high school, I could understand it, but does anyone have any compelling reasons why these courses would be a good idea for an elementary-aged child?

Cat

[dirty ethel rackham]

I am using GLL for Honors Chem for my 9th grade son. I am sorely disappointed. I am royally ticked off that I paid that much money for this class. Basically, we got a syllabus and an instructor who does little more than grade homeworks, labs and tests. No class time to meet. Very little instructor communication. So, basically, my 9th grade son is teaching himself chemistry using a college-level textbook. While he is doing well in the class (if not a bit behind), there is very little interaction with the instructor and no interaction with other students. He is not very motivated because he is bored. For that amount of money, I could have hired a tutor and had a couple live lessons a month. This is a stark contrast to his Wheelock's Latin class with Regina Coeli where he has regular class time to meet online with other students and has interaction with the teacher several times a week.

My friend's son is using GLL for 2 classes - Environmental biology and Etymology. He is having a very similar experience with the Environmental biology class. He is having a slightly better experience with the Etymology class.

So, my answer to Gifted Learning Links is "never again!"

[Ida]

How disappointing. For that much money I definitely expect more than a book and a syllabus. I wish there were a place to get objective ratings of the various classes kind of like "rate your teachers." I imagine there is a fair amount of teacher turnover though. I know there's tons for the TIP summer program. My dh taught there 4 consecutive summers, and that was a rarity. This will be the first summer he's not teaching for TIP. Even though he will tell you that there is a lot of variation in class quality and instructor quality, he still feels the program is a uniquely positive experience for the the participants. A lot of that has to do with the social scene of being surrounded by other gifted student though, which of course you don't get in an online course. It's just so easy to get pulled in by their marketing and the course descriptions sound pretty cool, but it's a good, down to earth reminder that these things are often not all they're cracked up to be.

[cimhog]

Basically, we got a syllabus and an instructor who does little more than grade homeworks, labs and tests. No class time to meet. Very little instructor communication. So, basically, my 9th grade son is teaching himself chemistry using a college-level textbook. While he is doing well in the class (if not a bit behind), there is very little interaction with the instructor and no interaction with other students. He is not very motivated because he is bored.

I am new here...

My D also took Chemitry Honors with CTD. She goes to public school. School doesn't offer Chemistry until 11th grade.
So I registered her for this class. I felt the same way as the previous poster. The instructor does very little. So,
I wrote an e-mail to ctd. I will cut/paste their response below.

[cimhog]

From the GLL coordinator....
================================================== ==
Thank you for bringing this to my attention. It is always good to get feedback from parents and students about what they are looking for in when they choose online courses for their gifted students.


I think one of the strengths of our program is that our courses are developed and taught by "live" instructors that give personal and individualized attention to their students (unlike some other online programs in which computer software plays a large role and the feedback is automatically generated). However, the other side of this coin, so to speak, is that each instructor has his/her own style (just as one would find in a bricks-and-mortar classroom) and so there is some degree of fluctuation in the sort of experiences that students have. I would probably agree with the majority of the posts that noted this sort of fluctuation but also noted that most of the instructors are "fabulous and innovative" and that most of the courses are "well-designed and solid." Also worthy of note is that our instructors are trained to adjust their instructional style to the particular needs of the students they are teaching, so our instructors that are teaching at the Grades 3-5 Enrichment level are much more hands-on than those instructors teaching at the Honors and AP level, where we can assume that students have more highly developed independent study skills. One of the things we constantly struggle with is the conflicting feedback that we get about how much interaction vs independence students want at the Honors and AP level. We have been moving in the direction of offering more interaction (via real-time Virtual Classroom sessions, for example), but have received some feedback that students at this level are taking our courses in addition to a full load at school, they already have full schedules, it is hard to find a common time for everyone to get together, and that they want to be able to work independently and at their own pace through the material--that that is the principle reason they are taking a course online through our program. This is especially true with students taking math or science courses through us, and somewhat less true with students taking humanities courses. I welcome any feedback that you or others who have posted to this site have on this subject. I also would be more than happy to correspond directly with anyone thinking about enrolling their child in our program in order to discuss their particular needs and expectations and help them find the best course/instructor to find those needs. More than anything, we want students to have a successful GLL experience, so my policy is to be open and honest about our teachers, their experience, and their instructional style--and then to let the parents/students make the choice about whether a particular course, or our program in general, is a good fit for their needs.


Feel free to quote and/or copy paste my email to the thread. You may also direct other parents to my email address: gll@northwestern.edu


Best,
Dana Thomson
Program Coordinator, GLL

[Ida]

Cimhog, thanks for sharing. I guess her response does make me stop to ponder exactly what I would be looking for from this type of class. Primarily I want something that would be better than what I feel I could offer on my own. I can buy a college level text and assign chapters. I'm not there yet, but I do know the day will come when I won't be able to teach him math and science as well as someone who actually knows what they're doing. The feedback I would want to get from a GLL course needs to be thorough and insightful enough to be worth $750+. My son, like many gifted students, is a independent learner, and if they are making the argument that they don't need to offer as much in the way of interactive services because of the independent nature of these students, then why would we pay that much money for our children to do what they do anyway? I wonder if to some degree homeschoolers have higher expectations of these courses than do parents of schooled kids. We already don't buy into the idea that it takes an "expert" to educate our children and we don't have the insecurity of needing someone else's professional seal of approval on a syllabus for our students. It does sound like there may be some gems in the program. It would be nice if there were public place not associated with the program where participants could post reviews of individual courses and instructors. I'm sure CTD would hate that though. There's a decent amount that all of these gifted programs seem to want to keep under wraps. I really have mixed feelings about the whole system.

[cimhog]

and if they are making the argument that they don't need to offer as much in the way of interactive services because of the independent nature of these students, then why would we pay that much money for our children to do what they do anyway?

Totally agree with you on this


I wonder if to some degree homeschoolers have higher expectations of these courses than do parents of schooled kids. I am not a homeschooler. I felt the same way as you do.

It does sound like there may be some gems in the program.MCT teaches there. However, I did take a quick look at their syllabus. Seems to me the only added value is that they have weekly assignments and quiz.

[dirty ethel rackham]

I read this response and my first thought is "What a cop-out!" They really are not taking responsibility for their program. I cannot see how on God's green earth they can justify charging $750 (and more for the registration fee and the $100 book) for a syllabus and a grader. The instructor refused to come up with a lab supply list. When I questioned him about it, he told me that I had to review the labs in the syllabus and then come up with a supply list. Gee, then what is his job?!?! About 2 months into the course, he finally gave us a supply list.

Just because someone is academically talented doesn't mean they don't need mentoring, nor does it mean that they enjoy learning from a dry textbook without the benefit of interpersonal interaction any more than any other student. In fact, sometimes academically talented kids need more - they need to be challenged, engaged, channeled. They need to be thinking about the big questions. A dry textbook is not going to do that.

Seeing that there is no way to determine the quality of a class from them ahead of time, I cannot in any good conscience recommend their GLL courses. Their email abdication of responsibility confirms my opinion.

As soon as this term is over, I will be giving them a piece of my mind. I am very concerned about capricious grading, so I am holding my tongue for the time being.