S/O BJU English vs R&S English

[alilac]

As I look at the writing in Grade 2, I have a concern over BJU and wonder if this has created any difficulty in any of you using BJU.

In Chapter 2, they begin "Writing a Personal Story" and I'm wondering how this is done when we haven't reached nouns or verbs yet. In addition they then continue w/Nouns then Writing again, then Verbs, then Writing again. And they don't appear to be just sentences, but entire stories.

Isn't this sort of backwards, not teaching what is really needed to create a story? How has this worked for your kids? Did they have problems creating and writing?

R&S teaches sentences then writing a "sentence" and goes in those sort of steps rather than to write an entire story before learning nounds and verbs.

Just trying to find which program will suit us best. To recap, I have both and was given R&S as a freebie and I (still) can't decide between the two.

Thanks.

[TraceyS/FL]

Well, Abeka doesn't hit on grammar until 3rd grade....

It was an issue for my DD coming home in 2nd. She hadn't been taught at all that sentences have parts. Drove me bonkers for a few years. I finally go her into BJU 4th and that really helped her out - note we jumped from the beginning of Abeka 3rd to something else before the BJU.

BJUP 1st is talking about "naming" parts of sentences and action parts. We are only on lesson 81 - but this week we talked about "who did what" in a sentence, and recognizing incomplete sentences (Mommy worked vs Mommy worked in the garden). I'm guessing for a child that used their 1st grade it won't be a big issue. Do you have the TE for 2nd? it's on the shelf over my head and I guess i could look at it and see what they suggest.

HOpefully someone that jumped in at 2nd can help more.

[Bee]

in the elementary grades.She did fine with the book reports and research paper assignments. We started BJU english after doing FLL 1&2. I wasn't able to find any writing program that worked for her and it wasn't until I read WWE that I found what fits my philosophy about writing and young children .So for us BJU is great for grammar but we skip most of the writing assignments.

[alilac]

in the elementary grades.She did fine with the book reports and research paper assignments. We started BJU english after doing FLL 1&2. I wasn't able to find any writing program that worked for her and it wasn't until I read WWE that I found what fits my philosophy about writing and young children .So for us BJU is great for grammar but we skip most of the writing assignments.

Sorry, but what's "WWE"?:001_huh:

Ann

[TraceyS/FL]

WWE = Writing with Ease. A product of our fine hosts here at WTM Forums!

[alilac]

A product of our fine hosts here at WTM Forums!


Oh geez:ohmy: Well then that's embarassing.

Thanks.

[Wee Pip]

This is very typical of today's public & private schools. Schools put a great emphasis on kids' writing, beginning in Kindergarten. It's one of those things that public school moms always brag to me about, and make me wonder what I'm doing wrong:P My child doesn't perform that well! LOL. I love BJU's English, but I'm still not sure how to approach the writing assignments, which my 8yo fights. So anyhow...yes, BJU is going to follow a similar scope/sequence to other public & private schools, which means writing stories is going to be included in the program. If you choose to use BJU, you may decide to throw out the writing portions altogether, or tweak it to fit your needs. Or maybe you're child is a budding writer, and the writing assignments will be the thing they enjoy! So far, though, it sounds like you wouldn't find much value in the writing portions, and that it does not "match" with your personal teaching philosophy. If you aren't content to toss that part of the program or tweak it, then you may be unhappy with BJU as a program.

[TraceyS/FL]

Oh geez:ohmy: Well then that's embarassing.

Thanks.

Oh don't feel that way - or know that i had the same thing happen to me! LOL!!! :tongue_smilie:

[alilac]

This is very typical of today's public & private schools. Schools put a great emphasis on kids' writing, beginning in Kindergarten. It's one of those things that public school moms always brag to me about, and make me wonder what I'm doing wrong:P My child doesn't perform that well! LOL. I love BJU's English, but I'm still not sure how to approach the writing assignments, which my 8yo fights. So anyhow...yes, BJU is going to follow a similar scope/sequence to other public & private schools, which means writing stories is going to be included in the program. If you choose to use BJU, you may decide to throw out the writing portions altogether, or tweak it to fit your needs. Or maybe you're child is a budding writer, and the writing assignments will be the thing they enjoy! So far, though, it sounds like you wouldn't find much value in the writing portions, and that it does not "match" with your personal teaching philosophy. If you aren't content to toss that part of the program or tweak it, then you may be unhappy with BJU as a program.

That's very interesting as you mention it. I find that BJU does follow ps scopes that I question in their material. I definitely may not be happy with that. You're right.

I also heard someone speak (can't remember who) that talked about learning to write and they said that if you started teaching a child to write a phrase, a sentence, a paragraph, etc and started in grade 7, they'd be a fantastic writer, because they'd understand how to write (by using visual words) and would make up for what we would see as lost time because of better understanding visually, contextually (if this is a word:glare:). The gist was to create a beautiful sentence and that's it till the later grades. I wish I could remember who it was I saw at my convention last year. But the whole thing made sense at the time.

Thanks. You gave me something to think about.

[Cindyg]

We've used BJUP's English since grade 1 (now in grade 5). While I don't specifically remember the 2nd grade personal narrative, I don't remember having any difficulty with it either.

My son is a reluctant communicator. On the first day of 1st grade, the BJUP (HomeSat) teacher asked the kids to write a single sentence OR draw a picture -- and my son ran screaming out of the room in tears. LOL! (It wasn't funny at the time!)

Since then, he has really developed as a writer through the BJUP writing process. It's a specific five-step process that we go through together, so he's learned from me. It is not at all like what I've heard goes on at public schools: "Write a two-page paper on how you would feel if..." The assignments are specific and short, and not drawn out of the child's imagination. (A personal narrative is from the child's own experience.)

For the 5th grade personal narrative, my son wrote a memory of an afternoon he spent with his grandfather. You can imagine how delighted Grandpa was!

My parents often ask me if my son writes these wonderful papers all by himself. (In other words, is this his talent or Mom's. Not so impressive if it's *my* talent writing 5th grade reports!) I always explain that it's a process that we work through together. Yes, the words are his; but, no, if he were locked in a room by himself, he could not have come up with this composition. But he is learning how to come up with the compositions by working through the process with me.

Anyway, success here with BJUP and a reluctant writer!

[TraceyS/FL]

Cindy - this is great to hear! LOL!!! We don't write all of our sentences with Mrs. Walker right now, i shoot for 4 a week - up from 3 a month ago. But She has come a long way doing those - and I look forward to going thru the whole thing with her. I think she will be like your son! Her confidence is building sooooo much, i could kiss Mrs Walker :D

[Cindyg]

Cindy - this is great to hear! LOL!!! We don't write all of our sentences with Mrs. Walker right now, i shoot for 4 a week - up from 3 a month ago. But She has come a long way doing those - and I look forward to going thru the whole thing with her. I think she will be like your son! Her confidence is building sooooo much, i could kiss Mrs Walker :D

Mrs Walker (HomeSat teacher) is a godsend. We adore her!

[Spock]

As I look at the writing in Grade 2, I have a concern over BJU and wonder if this has created any difficulty in any of you using BJU.

In Chapter 2, they begin "Writing a Personal Story" and I'm wondering how this is done when we haven't reached nouns or verbs yet. In addition they then continue w/Nouns then Writing again, then Verbs, then Writing again. And they don't appear to be just sentences, but entire stories.

Isn't this sort of backwards, not teaching what is really needed to create a story? How has this worked for your kids? Did they have problems creating and writing?



A lot depends on your child. Two of my four children were dictating long, detailed stories for me to write down before their fifth birthdays. They easily moved on to writing their own stories once they could spell the words. The other two had a lot of trouble with assignments like "Write a Story", and took time to learn how to narrate. For this type of child, fiction writing should be downplayed, while factual writing is emphasized.

On the other hand, children don't need to know about nouns and verbs to tell a story. They have been speaking in complete sentences for quite a while by second grade. The difficult part is combining thinking of what to say, shortening it to an amount they can write without tiring out their hands, and figuring out how to spell/punctuate/capitalize what they decide to say--all at the same time.

I would match the curriculum to your child's style. Through the years I have used Abeka, Rod and Staff, Easy Grammar, and BJU for grammar. I keep going back to Rod and Staff. My children learn more from this series than any other we have tried. They do think it is dull, but they think all grammar books are dull, so that is no longer a factor with me.

[Julieofsardis]

I feel like I need to clarify my post in your other thread. We did BJU 6 and 7. I've never looked at the younger grades. Just as someone said in another post, we didn't do much writing instruction until then. By the time we really worked on writing my dd had a very good foundation in grammar.