What to do with a totally non-mathy kid in high school science?

[JanOH]

My dd loves science, but hates math, always has, probably always will. She's doing biology this year as a freshman which is fine because there's not much math involved, and she loves all the dissection, however, I'm doing Apologia Chemistry with my ds this year and looking ahead to dd next year, I can't imagine that she'll be able to handle this! At. All. She's doing fine in Algebra but it is a struggle for her.

What are my options? Does the average high school student need to have chemistry in this day and age? I never had it - I took General Science, Biology and then Botany in my ps and was that was fine (back in the dark ages!) I asked her yesterday what she would like to study next year and her choice was botany, of course, off the top of my head, I don't know of any botany courses that I've seen among homeschool publishers.

Any help, ideas, encouragement would be very much appreciated.

[MyThreeSons]

I used this with my artsy, music-oriented son:

http://www.pacworks.biz/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=41

It doesn't have labs, so if you need those, you could add in some from something like Castle Heights:

www.castleheightspress.com (http://www.castleheightspress.com)

[Jean in Wisc]

Some of the colleges we looked into required Chemistry.

My two older kids took Physical Science, Biology, and Chemistry, and both struggled with Chemistry their junior year. For two totally different reasons, they both ended up shelving the text for the year and then went back to do it their senior year. I can't explain the phenomena, but when they were seniors, their brains put it all together--maybe they had gotten far enough in math plus a higher maturity level???--but BOTH of them starting doing the chem book at an alarming speed: my dd did 2 to 3 chapters a week; my ds has been known to do an entire chapter in a day--and they got straight A's!!!! This is significant with ds because he was such a math-phobic kid. (You know, one of those "what have you done with my child" stories.) Ds is now planning to do physics 2nd semester. (Yeah, I think he's ready for college.)

So, from my experience I'd say, go ahead and do something else. Plan on Chem her senior year and let her get her math together.

BTW, you could always do an astronomy class like Signs and Seasons (http://shadesofwhite.typepad.com/shades_of_white/2009/01/jay-ryans-signs-and-seasons-understanding-the-elements-of-classical-astronomy.html) :).

Jean (the astronomy buff)

[Nan in Mass]

MODG's Natural History Syllabus with some suppliments, Ham radio license (great into to physics), human anatomy (made our own), Conceptual Physics, and is now doing Intro Chem at the CC.

[tajott]

This has always intrigued ~me~, but i never found anyone who had actually used it, nor been able to meet it in person. Tell me more. I think this would have been a good one for my oldest who I tell about below.

[tajott]

Mine did Gen Sci in 9th, Phy Sci in 10th, skipped Biology and went to Friendly Chem with a lab kit (Chem 1000 that I bought from Hobby Lobby with a 40% off coupon) for 11th, and Signs & Seasons for 12th. She started high school hating science and i think makig her do Apologia did nothing to change those emotions, but after her last 2 years of "fun" science she now says she loves it, especially Astronomy.

I know it is not a popular concept, but I believe that Fulbright's elem. science is a great spine for the less enthusiastic student, and it can easily be beefed up with other things to make it high school level. You just have to use your own brain to figure out what will work and be "enough".

Teresa

[Ruth in Canada]

"Conceptual Chemistry" and "Conceptual Physics" are both very interesting and only use a limited amount of math. These books are used for 1st year university non-major science courses. They won't provide the background for university-level science classes, but they go a long way towards providing the science background we all need to be responsible citizens. (Conceptual Physics comes in high school and university books. We used the high school version and I was very happy I had the teacher's manual. Conceptual Chemistry is currently only available in one version. The accompanying DVD is very good for an audio-visual learner.)

[MKW]

I used this with my artsy, music-oriented son:

http://www.pacworks.biz/store/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=41

It doesn't have labs, so if you need those, you could add in some from something like Castle Heights:

www.castleheightspress.com (http://www.castleheightspress.com)

Just curious if you used this for one year or two, and what courses/credits you will list it as on the transcript. Also, have you used any of the other science courses from this company? Thanks!

[Heather in VA]

Our public schools will only give you a modified diploma if you don't take Chemistry. IMHO she needs it. Many colleges expect it as well. Frankly just because she's not mathy doesn't mean she shouldn't have to take standard classes in all disciplines. No one considers it ok for mathy kids not to have to take history and literature. Its the same for non-mathy kids. It doesn't sound like she has a learning disability. I would assume she's going to take more math than just Algebra as well so it may not be her favorite and it may take alot of work, but that's school.

So yes - she needs chemistry.

Heather

[Kareni]

My teen did a year of Geology at the local community college (two quarters of Introduction to Geology; the third quarter's class was titled Rocks and Minerals). All were very math light.

Regards,
Kareni

[MyThreeSons]

I'm calling it Integrated Physics and Chemistry, with one unit of credit. It can be covered in 36 weeks. There are 12 chapters, each in a self-contained booklet of 3 sections, with 5 lessons per section. Each lesson is 3 to 5 pages long, with plenty of illustrations. The reading level is not intense at all -- it is rather narrative in style. John Hudson Tiner is the main writer. You could flesh it out a little, include labs, and give it two credits over two years, I would think. While some chapters are decidedly Chemistry and others Physics, it's not so easy to separate it into two distinct courses, although I suppose you could if you wanted to.

The corresponding "Activities" booklet has a study guide-type of format that I think is great for students to use as they read along. There is one of these for each lesson, about 1-1/2 or 2 pages long. The items are a mixture of true/false, multiple choice and fill-in-the-blank.

There is a quiz for each section (5 lessons) and a test for each Chapter. They suggest that a score of 85% or higher on all quizzes earns an exemption from the test. (In fact, they print that promise on the quizzes.) Quizzes and tests are very similar in format to the activities sheets.

At the end of every lesson, there is a Life Principle, such as "A good name is more important than riches." or "A room without books is like a body without a soul." We pretty much skipped these; I definitely didn't test on them, although they are included on the activity sheets, quizzes and tests.

You may view samples here:
http://www.pacworks.com/pages/curriculum.html#_samples_ipc

To reiterate, this is not sufficient Physics or Chemistry for the student who is going into a science or engineering major, although it would make a good introductory course in 9th grade for such a student. (I plan to use it with my rising 9th grader rather than Apologia's Physical Science text.)

HTH,

[Kelley]

What about real Science 4 kids the Chemistry book? The author states on her blog that it may satisfy high school requirements and SAT Chemistry sections of that exam.

KElley

[JanOH]

Thanks for all the wonderful ideas. You've given us lots to think about.

[Karin]

What about real Science 4 kids the Chemistry book? The author states on her blog that it may satisfy high school requirements and SAT Chemistry sections of that exam.

KElley


Is that the level II? I asked her about that when I met her last year. She said that it would be good as part of dd's high school Chem requirements. Of course, dd wants to major in biochem, so that might be why she said that. I think she does plan to write a high school curricula, however. RS4K is for grades 7-9. While it follows the 10 chapter format of level I, there is a lot more to it!!! Dd, who already knows a lot of science on her own, likes it a lot.

[Martha]

I'd make her do chemistry, but if the text you have is heavy in math, I'd
get a different text and or do chemistry in a later grade.

phy sci, biology, chemistry is the plan for my oldest, who is also not a math friendly kid. because most colleges I've looked at expect at least biology and chemistry and several want 3 years of science.

I'm going to wait to see how his math skills have developed before deciding whether to bump science up a grade level having him finish chem in 12th instead of 11th. 1 year can make all the difference sometimes and it might make 9th grade less of a stressful beginning to high school.

[Mandy in TN]

Short answer- Yes. I would at least have her do a light non-mathy chemistry. Some colleges require chemistry and you never can tell- a little bit of positive exposure may produce an interest!:D

Some other options- Marine Biology, Astronomy, Ecology, Earth Science, Anatomy, Zoology

HTH-
Mandy