Need help with LA for 7th grader

[ABQmom]

We are having some problems with writing. She writes well, but does NOT like to change her writing in any way. Rod and Staff 6 this year has her doing some first and second drafts. She really hates the proofreading, but will do it as far as grammar and spelling are concerned--and she does it well. But, if I say, "well, I think they were wanting you to add some dialogue to this", or "Let's try to get away from using "It was"", she freaks out! She doesn't want to change any of the words.

I love Rod and Staff, but I'm not sure that I as the teacher am getting how to teach her to write from the lessons that are included. I don't know how to teach her to improve on her writing without her feeling like I'm changing it and then getting mad at me. I'm only asking her to work on one or two things. I praise what she has done well.

I want to keep Rod and Staff for next year. Is there some solution to my problem that I'm not seeing? Should I supplement with something? What? I'm afraid of overloading our schedule with to much. Any suggestions?

[Beth in Central TX]

What about using a writing rubric? It would give your daughter objective recommendations on writing a 'good' or 'excellent' paper, and the "constructive criticism" isn't coming directly from you.

http://www.tapestryofgrace.com/PDFs/GradingWriting.pdf

HTH!

[HiddenJewel]

The Challenge Checklist in Character Quality Language Arts is great for helping them change the wording in their compositions. You can see it in the online samples.

[Heather in VA]

Well to be honest I think at 7th grade she should be more receptive to constructive criticism. She isn't a beginning writer. I would explain firmly that it is your job to help her improve her writing by pointing out places she needs to improve. It is her job to take your comments and do the best job she can. I don't hear you saying that she doesn't understand the changes that need to be made or that she tries but doesn't make the changes right, only that she gets mad and doesn't want to do it. To me that's a discipline issue, not a curriculum issue.

Heather

[Beth in Central TX]

I agree with the discipline issue on more objective subjects like math and spelling, but writing is sooo subjective. The guidance that Sydni was giving her daughter led me to believe that it was more of an issue of style rather than grammar rules. I'm only chiming in here because I was (okay, am) a very sensitive writer, especially regarding style or content. You can tell me I spelled a word wrong or mixed my verb tenses, but if we're talking syntax, well...

Of course, any student should be teachable in this area, but it may take a little manuveuring in this case to show that your trying to improve her paper and not change her ideas.

Just my $0.02 though. FWIW, I usually let DH edit our boys' papers. I can't take constructive criticism, but I sure can give it. Ironic, huh?

[ABQmom]

Thanks for the advice all. And, I don't really think it's a discipline issue, but I will give that some thought. She's very compliant in correcting mistakes in other subjects, but like Beth said, I think she may be mad at me because she feels like I am attacking her personally. I certainly don't want to overlook the possibility of it being a bad attitude.

[OhElizabeth]

If I could just make a suggestion. I know I don't have a dc that age, but one thing I've noticed is that kids seem to take criticism better when you are CONFIDENT of what you're doing. I'm marrying the suggestions of the two others here, suggesting that you determine exactly what you're looking for (the rubric or standard) and have some confidence in implementing it. That confidence will engender respect, which may help with her ability to accept criticism. I had kids come into my WT2 class this year who distinctly did NOT like taking criticism from their mothers, but who took it from me, when I know far less than the other mothers, simply because I ACTED like I had a clue what I was doing, haha.

If R&S is not giving you clear expectations or a sense of what you're looking for, then maybe try something else like IEW or CW Homer for older students, where you would see clearly exactly what skills should be applied in the writing project and can hold her accountable. When I work through a draft with my students, I look for a skill they have not applied but should have and ASK them if they applied it. I ask them where they could apply it and lead them into it. You know what you're looking for and you confidently require it. I know you and I don't have degrees in english, but we all can see when a student hasn't included description, indirect quotes, etc. (whatever the lesson topic was) and ask them to bring it in. Just act confident and make her THINK you have a clue what you're doing! :)

And yes, you could make a little worksheet/checklist for the writing assignment. We have these in WT and they're an awesome thing. It can have basic things (punctuation, spelling, complete sentences, follows the basic assignment topic) and spaces to write in extra things specific to that assignment (paragraphing, adding description, whatever). That way she has a checklist and holds herself accountable to see if she has implemented the skill.

It may take getting outside criticism from a respected source to bridge the gap for a while. I definitely wouldn't eliminate yourself from the picture though. In my class, the kids who had been resisting their mothers seem to be doing much better now, partly because I think they learned their mothers were RIGHT. When they started having someone ELSE check their work, they realized (and were embarrassed by) there were tons of errors in their writing. Suddenly their mothers became their savior from embarrassment and welcome help! So keep working on it, be confident, have written, clear expectations, and see if you can get through it. And don't be afraid to get outside criticism if necessary.

[ABQmom]

I think you have hit the nail on the head. I don't know what I'm doing--or least am not confident that what I'm asking for is right. I need to see clearly the skills that are to be applied and hold her accountable for those things. I think this would help us both. Rod and Staff isn't clear enough for either of us on the writing assignments. Mmm... I think I'll take a look at the programs you suggested. I may be back with more questions. Thanks OhElizabeth!:)

[Heather in VA]

I just wanted to point out that when I said I think there is a discipline issue I didn't mean to imply that she's purposely being rebellious or disrepectful. I think that at this age it's time for her to learn how to accept criticism in these areas, even if she's sensitive about it. My 8 year old is very sensitive about the content of her writing. At her age I do take care with my suggestions but I am gradually helping her to learn that some writing is for her, and that writing I don't touch, but writing for school (and later for college, jobs etc) has specific expectations and requirements. My instructions and recommendations are to help her achieve those expectations.

[ABQmom]

Yep. I agree with you. I am needing some help in the area of writing that I feel I'm not getting with Rod and Staff, but I think you are right when you say that she needs to start accepting some criticism. I'm hoping that if my expectations become more clear to her, that she will have a better attitude when I correct her. However, she may not and this is something I will need to address. I do appreciate your comments. :)

[Suzanne in ABQ]

Hi ABQmom.
My only idea, other than the great ones you got already, would be with respect to style issues, specifically, over-using words and phrases. Tell her up front that she can only use "It was" one time, or not at all. Help her think of different ways to phrase the sentences. Then, for the next assignment, address some other issue that you've noticed in her writing.

BTW, I also live in the ABQ area (East Mtns.), and I have a 6th grade dd doing R&S6. How very cool to "meet" you here. :)

[Kathie in VA]

My dc started this way also. At this point they don't "write a paper" they write their draft. It's a draft till it's called done and then it's a paper. I also tell them that it is my job to help them improve their paper... if I don't find anything to fix (beyond spelling and grammar) then I didn't teach them anything and they didn't learn anything and we all just wasted our time. So they now expect me to ask for changes... that's the point of doing a paper for writing class.

Now my ds tends to miss some of my suggestions.... so we now stable all drafts together.. newest on top. This way we can see the development of the draft to paper. The final gets put freely into their binder.

hth

[Carol in Cal.]

It was taking the KidsWrite Basic class from Bravewriter.

Basically they take you through one thoroughly written and rewritten piece from conception to final polish. The focus of the class is coaching the mom in coaching the kid, but one of the keys was that there was an external assigner of rewriting, and a deadline; so it had to be done. It took the sting out of the process for DD (who was EXTREMLY unwilling/unable to rewrite before this) and gave her some tools that she now uses on her own.

I do not make her do this with every single thing that she writes, but she understands that it is the process to arrive at a final piece and she finally sees the value in rewriting.

[ABQmom]

Thanks for all the suggestions everyone.

Suzanne in ABQ--nice to "meet" you too! We live in the foothills off of Menaul and Juan Tabo. We've lived here for three years now. We like it!