Talk to me about MUS, sorry another math question

[A home for their hearts]

I'm really trying to research all my option for math. I think I have it down to two options, MUS, or BJU. The main reason I've been so turned off to MUS is I don't think my dc would understand the rods. We have a set that we used with miqon math and at the time they had some trouble understanding. That was over a year ago so maybe that would be able to use them now. I really want them to start understanding math, not just memorizing facts. Both of these curriculums are expenisve so I really need to be sure it'll work for us before I make any purchases. Thanks again!

[Parrothead]

I think the blocks that MUS utilizes are different from the rods that other math programs use. I may be wrong since I've only seen and never use the rod-thingies.

I'm not being very helpful. I'm tired and can't really explain the blocks well. Hopefully someone else will chime in.

[Karen in CO]

The MUS blocks are really good. I actually still get them out for explaining concepts sometimes. The blocks are color-coded but they also go together kind of like legos (except they don't stick very well). I can't stand the cuisinaire rods, but I like the MUS blocks. MUS is good, but it was too much of the same thing for my dd. We did the BJU second grade book (third edition) and it was really good for my dd. It stayed on a topic for a chapter with a short review section at the end of each lesson. It explained concepts in several different ways so that if one way didn't click, by the time you tried several others it all made sense. The next chapter would be on a different topic, but still with a short set of review problems. Then after a while it would cycle back to a topic previously covered and do it in more detail.

[Misty]

MUS blocks are way better than Miquon blocks. Don't let that stop you from using MUS.

That said, we use RightStart Math and I feel it's the best thing out there!

http://www.alabacus.com

[Lovedtodeath]

MUS blocks have squares that you can count. Huge difference! It's the same as using any other manipulative that way.

[3lilreds in NC]

We're pretty new to MUS, but I *love* the blocks. My girls understand them very well, and I have been impressed with how much they help them grasp the concepts. They are not at all like the Miquon blocks, which, frankly, have been used more for building things than doing math at our house. :)

ETA: For ease of teaching, IMO, MUS is great. When I looked at BJU, I was overwhelmed. MUS is wonderful with the DVDs.

[A home for their hearts]

I looked at the placement test for MUS, and I was thinking I would start them in Gamma, they know their addition and subtraction facts pretty well, but they haven't worked problems bigger than 3 digit or done anything with reading gauges. I would hate to have to start them in Beta. It would probably be a good review, but I don't want to spend another 9 months on addition and subtraction! We are ready to move on.

[Karen FL]

I didn't understand the manipulatives that go with Miquon either.
We use MUS and we didn't have any problems with their manupalatives.

[TraceyS/FL]

I looked at the placement test for MUS, and I was thinking I would start them in Gamma, they know their addition and subtraction facts pretty well, but they haven't worked problems bigger than 3 digit or done anything with reading gauges. I would hate to have to start them in Beta. It would probably be a good review, but I don't want to spend another 9 months on addition and subtraction! We are ready to move on.

You actually probably wouldn't spend 9 months on Beta - go thru at their pace after building the foundation. When they can teach you back the concept - move onto the next lesson. So it could be a month or a few, but then you'd be ready to move on to Gamma.

Don't cheat them out of the "foundation"!

[praisefor3]

we stepped back to Gamma. We didn't start until late October, took a long Christmas break, and will be done with the book in about 5 more lessons. And I didn't skip any pages at all. We are going slower now as these concepts are the real reason we looked for a different program in the first place but we will still move on to the next book in time to finish at least half of it.

[Cadam]

I looked at the placement test for MUS, and I was thinking I would start them in Gamma, they know their addition and subtraction facts pretty well, but they haven't worked problems bigger than 3 digit or done anything with reading gauges. I would hate to have to start them in Beta. It would probably be a good review, but I don't want to spend another 9 months on addition and subtraction! We are ready to move on.

You only spend as much time as the child needs to understand the concept. You could finish Beta in a couple of months if they know a good deal of it.

[dwkilburn1]

The singapore books used base ten blocks, but they sat on a shelf because I did not understand the system. MUS taught me the system (as well as DD), but mainly the blocks are used as manipulatives to give the students a concrete visual of math rather than expecting them to understand abstract thoughts. 2+2=4 does not make much sense, but 2 blocks plus two blocks equals 4 blocks does.

Anyway, my DD8 finished Alpha (we went back to make sure she understood all of the concepts), and we are a couple of lessons from finishing Beta just this year. The plan is to move on to Gamma, but I don't know if we will finish that since that is likely where she will get 'stuck'. MUS is easy to understand, and my DD is able to watch the DVD and understand the concept most of the time. There have only been a couple of lessons that we have had to go over after the video.

I have no experience with BJU to compare.

[Parrothead]

I looked at the placement test for MUS, and I was thinking I would start them in Gamma, they know their addition and subtraction facts pretty well, but they haven't worked problems bigger than 3 digit or done anything with reading gauges. I would hate to have to start them in Beta. It would probably be a good review, but I don't want to spend another 9 months on addition and subtraction! We are ready to move on.
Go to the MUS website and print out pages for the parts you need to cover from Alpha and Beta. There are 30 chapters in each book. If you print out chapter 1.... well, I think chapters 1 and 2 are probably too easy for kids that know basic addition and subtraction... and then do a chapter page a day before or after Gamma. If you do a chapter a day you'll have both books covered in 2-3 months.

If you get to a chapter from Alpha or Beta that your kids don't know the concept for stop and work on that concept for a few days.

[A home for their hearts]

Go to the MUS website and print out pages for the parts you need to cover from Alpha and Beta. There are 30 chapters in each book. If you print out chapter 1.... well, I think chapters 1 and 2 are probably too easy for kids that know basic addition and subtraction... and then do a chapter page a day before or after Gamma. If you do a chapter a day you'll have both books covered in 2-3 months.

If you get to a chapter from Alpha or Beta that your kids don't know the concept for stop and work on that concept for a few days.

Do you mean the online drill? If I end up having to buy both Alpha and Beta I'm going to go with something else. I don't have a lot of money to be buying curriculum when my dc already know there addition and subtraction facts. I was thinking if I do decide to go with MUS I would possibly start them out in Beta, and hopefully get through it in 2-3 months and then move on to Gamma. Do you think that would work well?

[yslek]

Do you mean the online drill? If I end up having to buy both Alpha and Beta I'm going to go with something else. I don't have a lot of money to be buying curriculum when my dc already know there addition and subtraction facts. I was thinking if I do decide to go with MUS I would possibly start them out in Beta, and hopefully get through it in 2-3 months and then move on to Gamma. Do you think that would work well?

I think she means the worksheet generator. That could possibly save you some $$$. You could generate worksheets for each lesson until you get "stuck" and buy whatever level you're at.

I have a friend who started using MUS last school year, or maybe at the tail end of the year before. Her oldest dd was in 5th grade, or mabye at the end of 4th. They started completely from the beginning, because her dd did not have a good understanding of math at all (had worked through Miquon, but really didn't "get" it--same thing happened with my eldest). She's currently in 6th grade and over halfway through Epsilon. She was able to complete 4 levels in one school year! While that is an expensive way to go, it worked for this family, because there are two younger sisters who are also using the books.

[Lovedtodeath]

The worksheet generator does not have any directions, or the first three lessons. And if they know their facts, I can't see them needing any from Alpha. If you need help with anything that might be covered in Alpha (place value, etc.) let me know. I think buying a whole level just for a couple of pointers would really be a waste.

[A home for their hearts]

The worksheet generator does not have any directions, or the first three lessons. And if they know their facts, I can't see them needing any from Alpha. If you need help with anything that might be covered in Alpha (place value, etc.) let me know. I think buying a whole level just for a couple of pointers would really be a waste.

I'm still trying to decide which math program to use. I think MUS might work but I'm waiting until I can see it at our convention in a couple of weeks before I make my final decision. My dc don't understand place value at all. The know which column is the ones, tens and hundreds but they don't understand the concept behind it. Is this reviewed at all in Beta?

[Cadam]

I'm still trying to decide which math program to use. I think MUS might work but I'm waiting until I can see it at our convention in a couple of weeks before I make my final decision. My dc don't understand place value at all. The know which column is the ones, tens and hundreds but they don't understand the concept behind it. Is this reviewed at all in Beta?

Yes, place value is reviewed in Beta.(I think it is reviewed in every book! Mr. D is a place value nut) Place value is a HUGE thing for MUS. The problem with just printing out worksheets from the website to avoid buying Beta, as some have suggested, is that you (the teacher) miss the foundation of MUS.

I could pull that off with my younger dd for a while because I have been though MUS with my older child. The worksheets are just generated by a basic worksheet generator. There are no word problems or any of the basic geometry or gages or money that is normally in the MUS pages.

Is there any chance you can barrow Beta from a friend for a few months? One of the benefits of MUS is going at the child's pace. If the child can tach you the lesson after a worksheet or two, you move on. You could spend 2 days on a lesson or 2 weeks on a lesson depending on how things are going. A friend of mine has borrowed Alpha and Beta from me this year for her 5th grader. All she had to buy from MUS was the workbooks. I think she will have him in Delta by Fall but the foundation has been invaluable.

If you kids know their basic math facts then you need to skip Alpha but if they are not solid on place value and longer addition you need to start in Beta. Certainly there will be lessons that you fly though but you don't want to miss that foundation. The foundation is much more important than worrying about a child being "behind". Without a complete grasp of place value and how numbers work your kids will continue to struggle with math. No matter what math program you choose it is very important for them to have a good foundation.

If you choose MUS please, please, please watch the introduction video. It explains the theory behind MUS and has a lot of teaching tips.

[Laura in WA]

We tried MUS Beta last year with my 7 yo. It helped tremendously with understanding place value. He was able to understand the blocks quickly. And I loved the DVDs.

However, we also borrowed RightStart B from a friend and ended up sticking with that. He preferred the abacus to the blocks and the variety in each day's lesson in RightStart - he loathed the MUS worksheets. (With MUS, he first uttered the words, "I just don't like math." Eek!)

All this to say, what works well for one child may not work for another. Definitely try it out first if at all possible.

Laura in WA

[diaperjoys]

I'm really trying to research all my option for math. I think I have it down to two options, MUS, or BJU.


Here's a vote for BJU. It is very hands-on; much more so than MUS, imo. And I ditto what another poster said above about how BJU explains things several different ways. We did MUS Primer, and were really suprised by the lack of review. Yes, there were 3 review pages for each lesson, but the content of those pages didn't always cover previous material enough for my son. For example, place value was a challenge for him to understand, and we spent a good deal of extra time on that, so that he could learn it pretty solidly before moving on. It was disappointing then, toward the end of the book, that the subject was dropped entirely, and there was no review of place value for the last 9 lessons or so of the book. So that hard work was quickly lost.

BJU was a great switch for our kiddos. Every concept is explained gradually, and many different types of manipulatives are used in varying ways so the child has ample opportunity for understanding.

We like it!

[Cadam]

Here's a vote for BJU. It is very hands-on; much more so than MUS, imo. And I ditto what another poster said above about how BJU explains things several different ways. We did MUS Primer, and were really suprised by the lack of review. Yes, there were 3 review pages for each lesson, but the content of those pages didn't always cover previous material enough for my son. For example, place value was a challenge for him to understand, and we spent a good deal of extra time on that, so that he could learn it pretty solidly before moving on. It was disappointing then, toward the end of the book, that the subject was dropped entirely, and there was no review of place value for the last 9 lessons or so of the book. So that hard work was quickly lost.

BJU was a great switch for our kiddos. Every concept is explained gradually, and many different types of manipulatives are used in varying ways so the child has ample opportunity for understanding.

We like it!

Just because I don't want anyone to misunderstand..... Primer is the only level of MUS that is not mastery. The intent of Primer is a fun introduction to math topics. It is not set up to have the kids really master the information. We only got Primer because I had a 4 yo begging for her own "math movie". It is really not representative of the MUS program.

I am so glad we have all of these programs to choose from. Various manipulatives and ways of explaining a concept drive my ds crazy, even when Mr. Demme does it! So, the thing you love about BJU just confirms that it is not for us! :D

[ajjkt]

I think MUS is great. *I* love the blocks, but to be honest my kids, particularly my non-mathy DD6 prefers the abacus from RightStart. I really like both MUS and RightStart for offering lots of different strategies of how to approach a problem.

My DD just does not get the way MUS is explained, but really gets it with RightStart. DS just gets everything so quickly with the way MUS explains it that it all just clicks into place for him, Mr Demme's explanations really hit the right chord for him. We use RightStart with DS to cover geometry and broader topics that he won't hit in MUS yet but that he can do with the challenge in.

My greatest criticism of MUS is that while you are waiting for mastery to come can be very boring for the kids and the parent. We have the issue that facts seem to make sense very quickly, but take longer to be memorized. Again, this is more for DD than DS. While we are waiting for the new group of facts to be mastered, MUS feels like a daily drill. I don't know if I'm not doing it properly but it is just a boring mindless drill and is NOT hands on because the kids won't use the manipulatives for drill (they refuse).

RightStart is so much better for this because it changes daily and they keep practicing facts while moving on to the next lesson. THe facts are drilled with games (I'd recommend them as an add-on to any curriculum). They are not dry and boring, but the kids get to do other things at the same time. It is the only subject that I run sort of on time, because we often do several lessons in a day if it runs to about 30 minutes. The kids really love RightStart. There are so many toys, I mean manipulatives, with it that they think its fun. And did I mention that they explain place value in so many different ways that it has finally really cemented itself in DD's head? And DS who is very strong at maths is being challenged in his weakest area - spatial - and loving it?

I really do like the combination - MUS for mastery (particularly facts) and because DS 'clicks' with it. I think RS gives a stronger grounding though for kids and makes them more well rounded. Their toys are better. All said though, we use both.