Do you give your child a multiplication table?

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

My ds is in 4th grade, and basically has all the facts memorized -- there are a few that are hard to make stick, but he *is* getting them. I do expect him to know them all, but I am wondering if it is a good idea to give him a printed out times table to use. I don't want him to rely on it exclusively, but I don't want to frustrated him either.

The reason I'm asking is b/c I have a good friend who is allowing her 4th grader to also have a times table, which the child does reference; but again, this mom is anticipating that her daughter will get the facts down.

BTDT moms encouraged to respond with their insights on whether this was a good idea for your student or not.

TIA

[bethben]

I'm not a BTDT mom, but I do give my son the following times tables 6x6, 6x7, 6x8, 7x7, 7x8,8x8. Those are hard to do with skip counting. I do expect him to know the rest of them. The nines are easy enough because you can do a little fancy trick on your fingers (thank you singapore math!). Here it is in case you don't know. Hold up your 10 fingers. Let's say, the problem is 9x5. Hold down finger #5. Then look at the number of fingers before and after the held down finger. On the left are 4 fingers, on the right are 5 fingers. The answer is 45. So, the 9 table he should be able to figure out. Ds has been not needing his cheat sheet as much since he drills multiplication daily. He'll get it eventually.
Beth

[Blue Hen]

Yep, did this with both boys. Reduced the emphasis on memory while doing the math problems but the facts still got into their brains. We did do math fact sheets / speed drills all the way through 7th grade. Yes, my 7th grader still does these. His goal is to get his time to <2min per 100 math facts per operation.

Each child was required to fill out the times table on Monday and then he was permitted to use it for the week. The table was easy to make on WORD.

Oldest is working through AP Calculus, 11th grade, and younger is doing pre-algebra/algebra stuff.

Oh, I started doing the math table bit cause I remember having one in 4th grade too. I love math, am an engineer so I don't think it hurt me one bit.

Carole

[Stacy in NJ]

Nope. Fact memorization was a challege for both my kiddos. I felt that a chart would end up being a crutch. I would rather they just ask me if they really can't figure out a fact.

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

Yes, we drill daily here, too, but like you said, at some point skip counting becomes TOO much in the higher numbers. I've noticed that my ds has particular trouble with x8s

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

Yep, did this with both boys. Reduced the emphasis on memory while doing the math problems but the facts still got into their brains. We did do math fact sheets / speed drills all the way through 7th grade. Yes, my 7th grader still does these. His goal is to get his time to <2min per 100 math facts per operation. This is great to know. We use Flashmaster for math drill everyday.

Each child was required to fill out the times table on Monday and then he was permitted to use it for the week. Hmm, I'll have to keep this in mind!

Thanks for the encouragement! I love it when a mom who's already walked the path can provide some encouragement and guidance for those of us a few or more steps behind. Blessings to you!

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

Thanks for your opinion. Having the table be a crutch is something that I am concerned about.

[Kelli in TN]

Yes, I have taped a multiplication table to their desktops before. One kid did use it as a crutch so I removed it and hung it on a wall downstairs. He had to go downstairs to consult the table!!! He only used it when he was really stuck!

[SBP]

Yep. I finally broke down and gave DS10 one when we started long division. We've been drilling the facts every way I know of since he was seven, and some of them STILL aren't stuck in his brain. We still drill, and I still want him to memorize them, but giving him the table for division made it SO much less frustrating for him and allowed us to move forward instead of just floundering. Someday, I might realize that it was the wrong call, but for now, we're both a lot happier and it seems like we're more productive as well.

SBP

[Sweetpeach]

Yes, I let my oldest son use a multiplication table during Yr 3 Math . . . because the emphasis was on "doing math" and not on rote memorization.

He doesn't need it anymore, except for 6 x 9, which he can never remember.

I think the idea of having a multiplication chart hanging in a far, far away corner of the house is a great idea . . . thanks for the tip!

T

[elegantlion]

I bought a .99 placemat from Wal-mart with the multiplication facts. My ds has had a challenge memorizing the facts. We do not leave the placemat out, but he can get it with my permission. I allow him to use it ocassionally when I want him to memorize the process of something and don't want the frustration to overwhelm him.

We drilled with the placemat yesterday. The threat of having to write out any family in which he missed 2 or more was enough to make him think very hard. He missed 3 total, but managed to get them upon rethinking.

[merrymama]

When my children are learning multi-digit multiplication and division I allow them to fill out a blank multiplication grid each day, which they may use while working on their math assignment. (I check it before they start working on their actual assignment.) Dd14 used it through about 6th grade. At some point, she began to recall the facts more quickly than she could look them up and feels it was helpful for learning her facts. Ds10 is still doing this, and it is definitely helping him get the facts down. I don't think I would just give the child a table to use, but our system of having the child fill out a table to use seems to work.

[KJB]

When my kids start to learn multiplication, I have them fill out a multiplication table every single day. After they fill it out, we do their actual lesson.

If they don't remember a fact, I don't mind them looking at the chart they just finished. I find that after filling out the chart for awhile, they just know them. Then we drop the chart, and move on to speed drills in all four operations. Sometimes we do flash cards and sometimes written speed drill worksheets.

I remember in third grade having to memorize the table and recite it to my teacher. I've never forgotten a fact since. I've taken that memory as an inspiration to get my kids to memorize the table at about the time they hit third grade math.

[ChemMommy]

My ds is in 4th grade, and basically has all the facts memorized -- there are a few that are hard to make stick, but he *is* getting them. I do expect him to know them all, but I am wondering if it is a good idea to give him a printed out times table to use. I don't want him to rely on it exclusively, but I don't want to frustrated him either.

BTDT moms encouraged to respond with their insights on whether this was a good idea for your student or not.

TIA

Help him get the facts down!! Unless there is a major learning issue such that he will never really be able to master the multiplication facts, a 4th grader should be able to master those tables. Trust me! He will be so happy down the road that he can do math in his head for simple stuff like 12x3 or 7x8!

I tutored a ps girl in chemistry and she had to consult a calculator for 7-4 and for 24 divided by 2. That is an atrocity! She said that she was never encouraged to learn her addition or multiplication facts and was encouraged to use a calculator even in 2nd grade.

Please, please, stand firm on this one! Sorry for the vent, but I'm sitting here grading college gen chem exams and am NOT happy with the math skills I see. If I'd written them on another day, I would have said the same thing without the vigor!!:001_smile:

[mamato3 all-boy boys]

I allow him to use it ocassionally when I want him to memorize the process of something and don't want the frustration to overwhelm him.
YES! This is exactly what I want to avoid. I do expect him to know if facts, but at the same time, I want to be sure he is understanding the process and concepts of math. If all I'm seeing are multiplication errors, it becomes hard to see if he is even getting the concept.

We drilled with the placemat yesterday. The threat of having to write out any family in which he missed 2 or more was enough to make him think very hard. He missed 3 total, but managed to get them upon rethinking. I LOVE this idea. My ds is very competitive and loves a good challenge. You are a genius.

[keptwoman]

No I don't. Occasionally he is stuck on a table and I tell him to work backwards or forwards from one he does know. I know for us it would become a crutch. We also do drill to reinforce.

[Linda...inOwasso]

Lol, ummm... NO. But then, I'm a tough teacher. :) Dd8 does 100 written multiplication drills daily and will continue to until she gets every last one of them correct in under 3 minutes.

[jubilee]

Hijack moment...

Dd8 does 100 written multiplication drills daily and will continue to until she gets every last one of them correct in under 3 minutes.

Linda,

Do you make this on your own? Do you use a website to generate this? Please share your resources with this non-math mom:tongue_smilie:

Thanks!

[LizzyBee]

For a visual learner, using a multiplication table is a great way to learn the facts. I despaired of my dd12 ever learning her math facts even though we used to drill for 30 minutes a day. I finally just gave her a mult table to use during math, and about a year later, she finally knows them. (But I wouldn't go back and undo the drill. I think it was a combination of drill, Times Tales, and using the mult table that finally worked.)

[melissaL]

yes I allow my 8dd, and 10 ds to use times table chart for division only.
they also do 100 times math facts and can easily get it done in under 4 minutes.

I use the math facts/ drills that come with Saxon math.

[MerryAtHope]

I give my kids a blank times table to fill in themselves. After a couple of times, they know those facts pretty well.

Merry :-)

[Kayaking Mom]

After using Times Tales we haven't needed any helps. Really. I think it's an amazing product. Before then I gave the scholar a blank table and after they filled in it they could use it.

[JumpedIntoTheDeepEndFirst]

We use placemats at meals with information such as times tables but they don't follow us to lessons. I did have a times table hanging in the school room but then discovered that the kids were consulting it during their Saxon timed tests. (Needless to say I had neglected to tell them that they were not allowed to use it during that particular exercise--oops.) So now I have times tables that we can pull out as needed but not posted. I think it is necessary to separate out use of a times table for memorization, facts practice and other work (ie division) that uses multiplication facts. I guess, based on my experience I would make sure that use for memorization and other work didn't bleed into facts practice where memory is more important.

[Greta Lea]

We've drilled with flash cards, worksheets and then online drill at the MUS website (which he still does daily), but using a chart has been the BEST help with *memorizing* the facts. He is slowly using the chart less and less.

I think *seeing* the fact on the chart has helped. My ds is SO not an auditory learner, so just hearing me tell him the answer wouldn't have stuck. But I can see where your method would be more beneficial to an *auditory* learner.

Greta:)

[abbeyej]

There was a period of time when I had ds *fill*in* a blank multiplication table at the beginning of school each day, and he was allowed to use it for reference for the rest of that day. It was part of our overall program of math drill, and I think it was *well* worth the effort.

I would not give my child a pre-printed multiplication table.

[mchel210]

We also used times tales for 6-9 and that did the trick. Even my 5 yo knows all the 6-9 tables. Now I have them using Flashmaster everyday 10-15 minutes or so. My girls have competition trying to beat each others scores. My son in 7th grade has to be pushed a little more...but he needs the practice.

[langfam]

Ds struggled to learn times tables. After 2 months of trying to memorize 3 times tables, we went to Times Tales. Now he has no problems. It only took a few hours stretched over a week or so to learn all the difficult ones. It's such an amazing program! My husband uses it now for his tutoring students.

[Marty]

I despaired ever getting my dyslexic ds11 to learn all his times tables. We finally had success with Times Tales! It deals specifically with 6 thru 9's, the ones mentioned in the op's post. We got the Times Tales Deluxe, which includes division. He still needs prompting to 'remember the story' from TTD, but he does very well. We did the division part and that is taking a little longer to stick without always having the pictures available, as dyslexics need visual stuff.
I learned later that there was an extra version that had the 3's and 4's. He didn't have too much trouble with those, but a little. So we made up our own stories fashioned after TTD.

I like the idea of posting the times tables in another location in the house! :001_smile:

[Linda...inOwasso]

Christina,

Susan C. Anthony, the author of Spelling Plus, has some wonderful math fact drill books which are fabulous! Complete no-brainer for mom/teacher. She has a separate book of masters for add, sub, mult., div. All 100 facts are on 1 side of 1 8 1/2 x 11 page with plenty of room to write your answer.

They're progressive so if you're working through the addition book, you start with +1, then + 2, then +1 & +2 together, then +3, then +1 through +3 together. Each book includes the master sheets so you can make however many copies you need.

My dd's do a sheet every school day. It takes 5 minutes -- so it's super easy. Once they complete their worksheet w/ 100% 3 x in a row they get to move on to the next sheet.

There are tons of math facts programs out there... so go with whatever works for you. Here is the website to the products I use if you want to check them out:

http://www.susancanthony.com/Books/books.html

Good luck!!

[jubilee]

Thank you Linda!

I actually have Spelling Plus and have looked at her math resources. I probably will buckle down and purchase these new:O) If I can't see things in real life I at least like to know that others have had success with the product. Thanks again for taking the time to answer my question.



Christina,

Susan C. Anthony, the author of Spelling Plus, has some wonderful math fact drill books which are fabulous! Complete no-brainer for mom/teacher. She has a separate book of masters for add, sub, mult., div. All 100 facts are on 1 side of 1 8 1/2 x 11 page with plenty of room to write your answer.

They're progressive so if you're working through the addition book, you start with +1, then + 2, then +1 & +2 together, then +3, then +1 through +3 together. Each book includes the master sheets so you can make however many copies you need.

My dd's do a sheet every school day. It takes 5 minutes -- so it's super easy. Once they complete their worksheet w/ 100% 3 x in a row they get to move on to the next sheet.

There are tons of math facts programs out there... so go with whatever works for you. Here is the website to the products I use if you want to check them out:

http://www.susancanthony.com/Books/books.html

Good luck!!

[Pylegang]

I have not provided my son a chart to reference while doing his math work. We started by skip counting to songs. Now that I've introduced multiplicaton, he has a drill chart that he goes through each day and flash cards too. When he doesn't remember an answer, such as 7 x 8, he skip counts the 7's until he reaches the 8th number.

[clane]

Yes, I have taped a multiplication table to their desktops before. One kid did use it as a crutch so I removed it and hung it on a wall downstairs. He had to go downstairs to consult the table!!! He only used it when he was really stuck!

A friend did something similar with her dc. Chart (that they made together) on the fridge, child could consult, but had to remember the solution (no writing it down) and after a while the tricky problems were known facts.