Growing up bilingual and eschewing one language

[sagira]

I'm going to try and make this as short as possible. I'm originally from another country where English is only our fourth language. I'm happily married to an American, and he only speaks English to dc. We live in an area that widely speaks English only, just a few people speak Spanish around us. In a nearby city many people speak just Spanish.

However, Spanish is not the language I'm talking about. I speak Papiamento, my native language, to my dc since they were both born. Ds, 5, understands almost all of it, even long paragraphs. However, even though he has been exposed to this language since birth (albeit only by me, his mom, and my mother who visits roughly twice a year), he won't speak it. What's worse, sometimes he'll tell me, Why do you talk in Spanish? :confused: And I tell him, no, you know it's Papiamento.

I'm homeschooling him in English. Since I have been speaking English to him his vocabulary in English has improved drastically :001_huh: (even though he hears everyone in his world speaking English all the time)

Any people experts in language acquisition? I guess I just though speaking to him in my language would expose him to it and he would just learn it, YKWIM? I've even read all books to him in my native language from birth to three. Now he tells me he can't say the words and I see him struggling in my native language to speak a whole sentence. He can repeat what I say after I say it but he doesn't seem to able to speak good sentences without any help :confused:

My big question is why? I spent a lot of work all these years, and this is frustrating. Speaking a different language to my ds while everyone looks at me like I'm crazy -- what language is that? Any insight? Should I be speaking my native language to my dd (1)? She doesn't talk yet.

BTW I am aware of the fact that he has a benefit just by knowing a different language and he has an advantage to learning Spanish, which he's already learning easily

[WendyK]

I don't have an answer for you, but a somewhat similar situation. My husband speaks only German to our children and I speak only English to them. My son outright rejects to speak German. He does go along with the German instruction my husband does with him in the evenings, but other than that he not only shows no interest, he is very negative about it.

I think it is a wonderful opportunity to learn another language especially if one happens to live with a native speaker. But I can't convince my 6 year old of that. And I feel bad for my husband because he is sensitive and I think it hurts his feelings.

So I don't know. :confused:

[8FillTheHeart]

I don't have any real advice either. One of my closest friends is Colombian and her dh is Cuban-American. They only speak Spanish in their home. However, all of their older boys do not like it. They are homeschooled......they are surrounded by Spanish (they don't watch tv, either), but when the parents aren't around or aren't enforcing speaking in Spanish, they speak English with each other.

I don't know why. Is it b/c they know their friends speak English? B/c everyone around thems speaks English? I can't answer.

The one thing I do know is that our oldest ds was completely fluent in Portuguese (even slept walk in Portuguese) He had to make himself think in English at home. However, when we moved back to the states, he lost his Portuguese quickly. After a few yrs he couldn't remember any of it. The only advantage was that when he took Spanish, his accent was flawless. (I'm guessing b/c his brain had learned to process the letter formations in early childhood.)

[sagira]

So we're not unique in this situation. I think it hurts my feelings a bit too, even though I don't like to admit it :(

I guess I was so happy to share my language with him and to be able to hear someone else speak it..

Thanks for sharing. It means a lot :grouphug:

[Sophia]

I am Hispanic.
Growing up, my parents spoke Spanish to each other, but made a point of only speaking English to us kids.
To this day I *cannot* speak Spanish.
I understand 75 percent of what I hear, but I stutter out my sentences and have difficulty with the grammar, vocabulary, etc.
Learning a foreign language was never important to me~ had it been I think I would have picked it up easily, but since my parents never forced it, I opted the lazy way out.

My aunts and uncles who required their dc to learn Spanish would make their little ones repeat words to them in Spanish, work on their accent and respond to questions in Spanish on a regular basis.

I wish my parents had done the same with us :sad:

[Stacia]

Any people experts in language acquisition? I guess I just though speaking to him in my language would expose him to it and he would just learn it, YKWIM? I've even read all books to him in my native language from birth to three. Now he tells me he can't say the words and I see him struggling in my native language to speak a whole sentence. He can repeat what I say after I say it but he doesn't seem to able to speak good sentences without any help :confused:

Not much advice here either. Can you get books for him that are written in Papiamento? Did you switch to speaking more English to him after age 3? (Asking because you mentioned reading to him in Papiamento up to that age, but he's 5.) Could you use index cards to label things throughout the house using Papiamento? Maybe at this point, he needs not only the verbal, but also the visual? (Perhaps you're already doing these things, but I thought I'd mention these ideas.) Kids songs or cds in your native language?

We are in a similar situation. When dd was born, dh spoke only Dutch to her (though in English to me since I didn't know Dutch). Even though he spoke it to her constantly, she would always answer him in English. She understands it though. And, we're lucky to have found a Dutch school here in town, so she's been going there once a week for years now. She still rarely chooses to say much of anything in Dutch, though she can understand it very well & reads & writes pretty well in it too.

I guess I'd just continue to speak to him in your language as much as possible (except when doing hsing, which you said you're doing in English). When he answers you or says things in English, I guess I'd try to repeat what he just said in your language. Just keep doing it. Even if he's not speaking it, I'm sure he's understanding it. And, yes, I'd speak it to your dd too.

Good luck & hang in there. I think you're on the right track. Maybe he'll surprise you one day by speaking in Papiamento. It could also be that he's having a hard time w/ it right now because he's hitting a growth spurt or something. There are times that my kids have seemed to take a mental vacation & it often seems to be when they suddenly hit a big growth spurt. I think all their mental energy is being drained by the body working so hard on growing. Not that what I've said is scientific theory or anything -- just my gut feel, lol. :D

[Michelle in MO]

Any people experts in language acquisition? I guess I just though speaking to him in my language would expose him to it and he would just learn it, YKWIM? I've even read all books to him in my native language from birth to three. Now he tells me he can't say the words and I see him struggling in my native language to speak a whole sentence. He can repeat what I say after I say it but he doesn't seem to able to speak good sentences without any help :confused:

part of this may be his own inclination (he wants to speak English here), and part of this may be the time factor involved in assimilating two languages at once.

I can only tell you an anecdote, which may help put some perspective on the issue.

This involved a French teacher at the university I attended. Her father was French, and her mother was Italian (or, it may have been the other way around! :D ). At any rate, both spoke fluent French and Italian, and they both spoke French and Italian to her. She said that she could not speak one word until she was four years old, but when she was finally able to speak, she was able to speak both French and Italian fluently!

So, there may be a time factor involved here in your son being able to assimilate your native tongue to the point where he can write it. I think that acquisition of a second language tends to happen (for most people) in this order if they are exposed to all four forms of language: speaking, reading, writing, and listening

1. I think listening comprehension generally comes first; we can hear and understand certain words most easily.

2. I would tend to put speaking comprehension second for younger children and people who receive more exposure to speaking and listening.

3. I would put reading comprehension second for adult learners of a second language.

4. I would put written comprehension last for both children and adult learners of a second language.

I'm no expert, but I think the more passive forms (listening and reading comprehension) are easier for most people, whereas the more active forms (speaking and writing) are more difficult for most people. I think many more steps are involved in the brain in order to reach the level of good written ability in a foreign language. For instance, when doing Latin, I find that the most difficult aspect is translating English (my native tongue) into Latin.

So, I would keep trying with your son; don't push too much, but continue to expose him to all areas of language acquisition, and just be aware that he may continue to struggle with the written aspect of your native language for a while.

If it's any consolation, be encouraged that many native speakers of English still find writing in English to be difficult! You can head over to the high school forums or the K-8 forums and just start reading threads about "writing woes" to confirm that!

I'll have to look up your native language; I had not heard of it, but I'm fascinated now!

[betty]

I'm not bilingual. However, I have known a few families in this situation. So, I think it is not uncommon for the child to refuse to speak his parent's language. One former neighbor sent her ds to a spanish immersion school just so he would start speaking spanish. His mom and grandma only spoke to him in spanish, but he always responded in English. He learned English from his older brother and sister. His parents were divorced and his dad was from the UAE and went back so the dad only saw the kids once a year. Another friend of mine is Dutch, but was raised in Spanish speaking countries and attended schools in English. Dutch was always spoken at home and the family went to Holland for a month a year. Her younger sister does not speak Dutch. She started refusing to speak it when she was school age. I don't know the reasoning for this happening, but I'm sure there is a pychologist who has researched the phenomenon.

I think you should continue to speak in your native language to your dc. Even if you ds refuses to use it. Being around the language and understanding what you say develops his brain further. Another thing to remember is that some sounds are made only in some languages. If you don't have imprinting for these sounds as a young child you may never be able to learn them. So, whether or not a person develops fluency from exposure as a child, the exposure itself helps him. I think early exposure helps set up language pathways that just wouldn't form otherwise. So, if it were me I'd definitely speak the your dd in your native language too.

When my oldest was a baby, I worked and he was in daycare fulltime. The worker who had my ds in her "group" spoke to him in farsi. She told and apologized and was worried I'd be upset at her for doing this. I encouraged her to keep speaking to him in farsi. Ds is now 13. He doesn't speak Farsi, but he's had the opportunity to study French and is quite good at it.

[Mom to Aly]

I have experience with this for both myself and my dd. I grew up with a father who was from India--he was fluent in 14 languages; English was his first language, then Punjabi, then Hindi. He spoke Sanskrit to me, but only in a religious context, and Persian, related to poetry and literature, also French when I was older, but, again, only related to poetry (he would read poetry to me in these languages and then translate them into English, nothing else).

I grew up fluent in English, speaking Sanskrit well related to the religion, so Persian or French, and speaking Hindi and Punjabi well, but I have never been able to tell the difference between them--I understand them fluently, but mix them up completely, and don't know why (so much fun in India! Strangers think I'm great fun to listen to!). When I've been there for a while, I usually end up with just Hindi, but it takes me a while.

Oh, and, btw, I haven't been there since a couple of years after my dad died, and now, although I still understand the Sanskrit, the Hindi & Punjabi have faded tremendously for me, which really shocks me.

I did study different languages in school; Spanish I did fine in, Latin was a breeze, although I only studied it for derivatives, I did a bit of Persian, which I found very easy and loved, but had always wanted to learn French, for the literature, and when I started, it was the most natural thing I had ever done--it took me a year and a half of intensive study to gain enough fluency to start my master's. I have a perfect Parisian accent--I studied at a university, which, at the time, had the best French dep't. in the country, and I was well known throughout the dep't. for being a prodigious language student. I think it was really because of what I had heard when I was young, even though I had never spoken a word.

Move on to my dd. My xh is from Paris; I met him there when I was doing one of my Master's at La Sorbonne. We raised our daughter bilingual; funnily enough, I spoke French to her at first, and xh spoke English, until she started speaking, and it was mostly in English, then he switched to French. But she was completely bilingual in both; she heard English all around her, and from me when we were out, but we had friends that were French and she got French at home. She was a very early speaker, spoke in full sentences, in both languages, before she was one, kept them completely separate, no prob.

Then my xh left when she was 5, and horribly verbally and emotionally abused her just before leaving and after leaving. She suddenly, and adamantly, refused to speak French. She got to where she would freak out if I tried to speak French. I understand the mentality behind this, of course.

It wasn't until a couple of months ago that she finally decided she wanted to learn French. This is important to me; it is a big part of my life, which I wanted her to understand. I didn't want her to only associate it with her dad; I have degrees in 17th and 19th century French lit, which I adore, and I want her to understand that that is a separate part of my life, I want to take her to France and Quebec, and have her able to enjoy it.

If I speak in French, and she is not paying attention, she understands it most of the time, but once she thinks about it, it is gone, she doesn't get it at all. We are just starting to work on it now.

Hope this gives you some insight? I'm not really sure. I do feel, if you totally give up on the language, there may be some trace of it later, like with my French, but it may also just vanish. If it were me, I wouldn't totally let go. According to studies I did in linguistics, although it was a bit ago, they said that as long as you have a good start by the age of 8, they can still get native fluency (4 is recommended).

Best of luck!!

[CleoQc]

I live in an area with a high number of immigrants and a lot of inter-marriages. Many families speak two languages at home, neither of them official to the country. The kids learn French in daycare (first official language here) and English in the street. At home, it would be a mix of anything you can imagine (Farsi, Greek, Arabic, Hindu, name it we have it.)

There have been some studies on those kids. Language acquisition is slower than for kids who learn less languages, but they catch up pretty fast, around 5 or 6. However, one thing that came out of the studies is that, if a language is only heard at home from one parent and nowhere else, the kids don't bother learning it. They'll understand it for a while, but they won't speak it. If the parent ever gives up on the language, it's gone forever in the kids.

I'd love to find that study online, but I can't remember who did it. It was in the local papers about 10 years ago and was pretty big (locally!) I lived in a different street then, about 2 miles away. On that street, we were the only unilingual family. It was the United Nations within 20 houses! LOL.. I once saw a tibetan monk in full orange robe and sandals meet a woman in a complete burka. Yes, they greeted each other :001_smile:

[sagira]

Thanks for the reassurance and commiseration, everyone :grouphug:

I feel like I got a good kick in the pants for continuing to do what I'm doing and not giving up! :D

These are the things I'm going to do again in Papiamento:

- Speaking to him, guiding him and directing him
- Reading to him (I have a few good children's books)
- Putting on CDs
- After he's a fluent reader in English, teach him to read in Papiamento (maybe even sooner, concurrently? I don't know. He's just beginning to read.)

[Kate in Arabia]

I think you should keep on as you are. I think kids go through phases, where they want to speak it or refuse to speak it. In my experience, it's pretty common to have kids refuse to speak the language you're teaching them.

What I noticed in my own case, is that the kids may balk at speaking the language, but that doesn't mean they aren't learning it. My oldest ds wouldn't speak much Arabic before, but a couple summers back we were visiting relatives in Saudi Arabia, and one day some men came to visit dh, but he and fil were out. Ds was easily able to sit with them and play host until dh arrived, speaking only in Arabic. Color me shocked, lol.

I have had friends who have forced the issue, by refusing to respond unless the child speaks in the target language for example; it worked for them, but I don't think it would work well in my case.

[Annie N]

I went through something similar; we moved to another country when I was 4 without my father (complicated but not divorce!) and learned that language, since my mother and everyone else was using it.

When we returned to the States and my father, I refused to speak in that language even tho my mother was continuing to use it with me, and I re-learned English.

I put that together with a family I knew: the parents had a very strong regional accent but had moved elsewhere. Their daughter was an exact, but tiny!, version of her mother, but she totally had the accent of where they had moved to!!!! It was funny.

So it is my theory that there is something in our language acquisition that gives priority to the language spoken not by our parents but by those around outside the home.

I would suggest that you continue using Papiamento with him, and as much as possible expose him to books in that language as he grows older. My "second" language is still somewhat at a 4-year-old's level (and I have seen this in the children of immigrants educated in English), so try to get him used to more advanced levels of the language as he grows older, maybe teaching him a course in the language each year or requiring some school writing. Also math! get him to use both languages.

Even tho it will be tough, keep it up. One day he will thank you!

[Pencil Pusher]

Ooh, ooh, ooh--pick me! pick me! I've spent yrs teaching & doing research in language acquisition!

When children are raised in a bilingual home, they are often slower to speak in *either* language, but when their speech does begin, it can be like an explosion.

I think what you're doing sounds perfect. Honestly, if you want ds to become more fluent in your native language, I'd suggest speaking *only* that language to him. Even for school.

Studies show that when parents speak different languages to their dc, the most effective way for dc to learn both languages is to stick to the one they represent *exclusively.*

Beyond that, it gets a little muddy--I've had a couple of babies since the last time I was in school, lol. But if you have any other questions, let me know...I might remember something else! :001_huh:

[Heather in the Kootenays]

They refused to speak it. However, she persisted and when they were ready, they started to speak.

Keep at it. It's such a wonderful gift to give a child.

[Heather in the Kootenays]

They refused to speak it. However, she persisted and when they were ready, they started to speak.

Keep at it. It's such a wonderful gift to give a child.

[abbeyej]

A Brazilian friend of mine had a similar problem with her dd. She spoke Portuguese and English to her from birth, but her dd only ever spoke English. At one point, my friend even invested in more tv coverage just so she could get shows in Portuguese for her (the mom), because she needed to hear it more regularly in order to be inspired to keep speaking to her dd (when everyone around her including her dd only spoke English).

Still, hardly a word from her dd.

Finally, when she was almost 5, they went and spent an entire summer in Rio with her extended family. Her dd refused to speak (though she clearly understood) for nearly two weeks. Then, all of a sudden one day, playing with her cousins, she started speaking. It took another couple of days for her to become more comfortable, but she was fairly fluent from the time she chose to open her mouth, and of course her accent was flawless.

It was a huge relief to her mother, as you can imagine. But it also made her feel like she needed to try to make an extended trip every year or two from then on... On the other hand, once they came back home, her dd was more willing to speak Portuguese to her mother and they made an effort to have phone conversations in Portuguese with her aunts and other family in Rio... She did take to *insisting* more on Portuguese responses from her dd. "No, ask for the cookie in Portuguese" (said in Portuguese, of course, which I can't speak at all, so you'll have to imagine), etc...

Another friend of mine is Polish, but grew up in Czechoslovakia. She said that as a child, she thought Polish was just their family's personal language. She did speak it at home, because her grandparents lived with them, but she would have been *mortified* to speak what she perceived as a "nonsense language" in public! ;) (As an adult, she speaks both of those languages and also English and French fluently.)

I *do* think it's valuable for your son to hear you speak to him in your native language (and not just near him, but *to* him), even if he chooses not to respond at this time. You could also do as my friend did, and make a more conscious effort to require him to respond in that language. Some people suggest setting aside a certain time of day when only the second language (since English is first, for him) is allowed.

[matroyshka]

I think it's very common for kids raised with a second language that is not spoken by the community at large to go through a phase where they refuse to speak it. But as others have said, it doesn't mean they're not learning it.

I had read up on this when my kids were still young - I think as another poster says, often the kids think it's a personal or nonsense lanugage the parent(s) made up (books, videos, and maybe even a couple of other relatives to the contrary). So they don't see the point and think the parents may be a bit nuts. :tongue_smilie:

That's one reason I decided that I would make it a huge priority to make sure my kids heard non-related adults and especially other kids speaking the languages I wanted them to know (German and Spanish). For the former, I found a playgroup and then later enrolled them in a Sat. School. For the latter it's been harder (ironically, with it being a language more commonly spoken here) - first I hired a tutor but had them taught with friends. Now I'm teaching myself, but still with friends. And last year we took a trip to Germany. Seeing that there really was a whole country full of people that spoke this language really did make an impression.

They are becoming fairly willing to speak now in German (at 10 and 7), although they did go through a phase of "no German, mom!" And they're becoming increasingly interested in the Spanish, and even other languages (they quite enthusiastically took a Chinese class earlier this year).

Now I'm guessing it'd be fairly difficult to find non-related speakers of Papiamento (where is that spoken?) to hang with, but I'd be fairly confident that he is learning it, all of his protests to the contrary... listening to songs is a great idea (you mentioned you had CDs) - is it at all possible to get DVDs in Papiamento? One thing I did was tell the kids they could only watch cartoons in German...

[Mom to Aly]

Something I did for my dd, before I discovered ebay and purchased a TON of books in French, was print up the words in French for her books, and put them into her books in English (I used the pages that are all adhesive behind, like big sticker pages). I didn't cover the English, just put the French below it, so she could have both.

But if you want his to be exclusively Papiamento, you could cover the English words, and leave only Papiamento showing. You would probably have to cover the words first with construction paper of a dark color to block out the words.

Also, something I used to recommend to students who were starting to study French, and my dd and I are about to do, as he gets older and starts to read, you might want to take masking tape, and use it to label things around the house in Papiamento--the word for "door" on the door, etc.

I'm so glad you aren't giving up!! Good luck!!

[*anj*]

I have friends who've been frustrated by this as well. I also have a friend who has had success.

Friend one: From Colombia, married to an American. She speaks Spanish exclusively to the children (including in public and for school.) Dad speaks English. The kids see extended family on both sides fairly often, and the same language rules apply. But they have lots of friends who are American and they are aware that they're different. So if they're out in public and mom says "Donde esta la chica?" The boys (ages 6-11) will answer "She's over there on the swing." But if they're at home they'll answer her in Spanish. What's very interesting is that if they need something from Mom while they're out they will ask her the question in Spanish. So I'd say the boys are pretty well adjusted to speaking Spanish, though they aren't thrilled about it. Sometimes when I want to practice my Spanish I'll speak to them, but they don't like it very much. Once I was serving ice cream at a party and I said "Quieres helado? Que tipo? Chocolate?" and the oldest boy just looked at me and said "Chocolate" in his best NJ accent. But they'll humor me sometimes. :glare:

Her youngest (4yog) will not speak Spanish to her in front of people anymore. She did when she was younger, she'd even speak it to me, but not now. She just goes mute.

Friend Two: From Mexico, husband is too. All Spanish in the home. They return to Mexico a couple of times a year and usually stay for two weeks. Relatives visit sometimes. The older child (8yob) will speak openly to his mom, he even has an accent. The younger one (6yog) will not speak it at all. Not at home, not in public. When she goes to Mexico she stares at people like she doesn't know what they're talking about.

Friend Three: Both spouses are from South Africa, so they speak Afrikaans at home. Their dd has always spoken it with them both in public and private. They go back to SA once a year and stay for about a month. Dd was born in SA and really does feel like it's a homeland for her. She is very connected to it. She easily goes back and forth between English and Afrikaans.

Sometimes I think that it's more about the temperament of the individual child than about a more general theory. As I (and others) have described, there doesn't seem to be one consistent method of getting children to speak both languages. Sometimes I think it's a control issue like some others. If it means too much to you, they realize they have some power over your happiness or lack thereof.

[CactusPair]

My dh rejected his first language, Italian, when he started public school and began learning English. He lived in an Italian-speaking home, but would speak only English with his mother after he learned that language.

They lived with his grandparents, who only spoke Italian and understood almost no English, so dh had to keep it up with them, at least on a basic level. He lost a lot of Italian language skills since leaving home, which is so sad to me. I wish he was able to teach and speak Italian with our dc now. I wish they could know that part of their heritage.

Keep up your efforts. You and your dc will be so happy that you did. It is such a gift you're giving!:001_smile:

[TeacherZee]

Keep doing what you are doing. I grew up bilingual and I refused to speak English (my second language) until I was a teenager. Now English is actually the language I speak the most.:grouphug:

[Susan in KY]

I haven't read all the replies yet, but my heart goes out to you. Hope this isn't a repeat.

As an ESL teacher/bilingual educator, I need to tell you that this is 100% normal. Kids will always choose the dominant cultural language. It is very rare for them to hang on to the second language past the age of 5 if they have a choice. Since you speak English, your kids have have a choice.

The following may comfort you, however: all language acquisition prior to the age of 5 is native language acquisition. That means that the input is hard-wiring neurological pathways into your son's brain. The language he has learned up to now will be there for his use when he gets back to it in his 20's (and most do, as a matter of fact, when given the opportunity). It'll come back to him easily, though he'll need some effort to learn an adult vocab. Never fear.

I am sorry for the implications in your heart. :-( Keep at it, especially when your mom is here and it may help. Just don't force him to answer. Tell him jokes, lovely bedtime stories, etc, and maybe you can imprint wonderful memories surrounding your language for him. When he's older, he'll come back to it.

Susan

[mLeroux]

I don't think you have anything to worry about, he's still a little young. I think he's dealing with with english now and is trying to grasp it. I wouldn't expect anything from him until 10 or 11, until then though don't stop speaking papiamento. Is there any way you can take him back to your home country for a summer or couple of months? You can do this when he a little older and I promise the papiamento will surely come out then.

My parents are hispanic and although I was born and raised here I was spoken spanish by my grandmother from day one, she lived with us. My parents I would mostly speak to in english even if they spoke to me in spanish. When I was 14 my mom and I decided to go live in her home country and have me attend high school over there. Well my spanish was very limited, I felt. My grammar was horrible and I never knew how to read or write it (since spanish is totally phonetic I picked it up in about a months time). Anyway my point is once I was thrust in that situation my spanish improved greatly in a matter of months. I also have friends from Pakistan who said that they're parents would speak to them in their language, but when they went to Pakistan for a summer when they were 5 and picked it up.

Living in the NYC I see this all the time. It's a very diverse place and I would say the majority of kids who's parents come from other countries speak that language at some point atleast by the time they are teens. It just really helps to take them back to the that particular country for a while.

Now my mil is mad at me because my girls don't know Urdu, the language spoken in Pakistan. DH does not speak it to them at all, I mean he may speak it sometimes like, bring me this, lets go out, are you hungry? and they understand that, but can not speak for the life of them. We have always spoken english to them because I guess we wanted everyone to understand what was being said at all times. My youngest who is 4 can speak more Urdu than the 9 year old it seems.

My grandmother is mad because my girls don't speak spanish. I feel really bad about that. About a year ago I decided I was going to speak to them in spanish at home and enforce that my dh speak in his. It has helped their comprehension a bit, but they still don't speak it. I'm hoping one day they can atleast construct a simple sentance.

I'm not a specialist, but I hope the experience helps you out some.

Michelle

[*anj*]

OP, does this make sense?

trein riba un mucha den un idioma e homber mester konosé, í kuandu e homber ta bieu e homber lo bolbe na e.

[Janet in Toronto]

Up here in Canada, many children grow up in 2-language households, where one parent speaks English and the other French. We did this with our older child for quite a while and he is quite fluent in French. DH speaks three languages, two of which were taught intensively at school (French and Arabic). He learned English as an adult. It is very important to him that our children speak French because that is the language that they can communication with their grandmother. Most of their aunts, uncles, and cousins on DHs side speak some English, but it makes life easier to have French when we visit.

There is NO doubt that knowing more than one language enriches many areas of ones life, and makes learning additional languages easier. I know how difficult it is to keep it up in the face of discouragement, but we are really glad we persevered.

Ignore people around you who don't get it. I was amazed at how many people looked askance when my MIL visited me in Atlanta and we were speaking French in Target, the only language that we share. There was *almost* a look of disgust from a couple of people. Unbelievable. But a sweet cashier originally from Haiti addressed my MIL in French and it made her day!

[sagira]

Ooh, ooh, ooh--pick me! pick me! I've spent yrs teaching & doing research in language acquisition!
:lol:

Then you are the one I had in mind when I first started the thread :)

When children are raised in a bilingual home, they are often slower to speak in *either* language, but when their speech does begin, it can be like an explosion.

I can see that. Dd is still quiet. No words yet.

I think what you're doing sounds perfect. Honestly, if you want ds to become more fluent in your native language, I'd suggest speaking *only* that language to him. Even for school.

Really? Will he still be learning proper English if I'm homeschooling him in Papiamento?

Thank you!

[sagira]

"trein riba un mucha den un idioma e homber mester konosé, í kuandu e homber ta bieu e homber lo bolbe na e".

Wow! Where'd you get that? :)

OK, literally translated: Train on a child in a language the man has to know, and when the man is old he will return to it.

Hey! I think I know this!! Train a child in the way he should go.. and when he is old he will not turn away from it.. Something like that :D

Cool! :party:

BTW, Papiamento is spoken in Aruba, Curacao and Bonaire. Three little islands in the Southern Caribbean :)

[CleoQc]

Really? Will he still be learning proper English if I'm homeschooling him in Papiamento?


Yes! I never thought my son any English. I did expose him to it by various activities outside the home though, scouts, library activities, swim team, etc..
Now that he's almost 11, we're switching a lot of his homeschooling to English material, because they're just so much better than using French school material (there's no homeschooling material in French, except in math, and he's done with that..)

[WendyK]

Keep doing what you are doing. I grew up bilingual and I refused to speak English (my second language) until I was a teenager. Now English is actually the language I speak the most.:grouphug: That is good to know! I will tell my DH. :001_smile:

[Cadam]

I may be totally wrong but I had heard that it takes until about 3rd grade for kids to speak 2 languages equally well. He has only recently gotten the English grammar down, the other language will take longer because he doesn't hear it as much. Please please don't stop teaching him!! No one ever regrets learning more languages, only the other way around.

[*anj*]

"trein riba un mucha den un idioma e homber mester konosé, í kuandu e homber ta bieu e homber lo bolbe na e".

Wow! Where'd you get that? :)

OK, literally translated: Train on a child in a language the man has to know, and when the man is old he will return to it.

Hey! I think I know this!! Train a child in the way he should go.. and when he is old he will not turn away from it.. Something like that :D


Yes, I was attempting to do a play on words based on that verse. I found the translator here (http://www.donamaro.nl/papiamentu/).
There are lots of them on the web, and I think it's fun to play with them even though I realize that they don't do a perfect job. I have some friends who are South African and I've sent them whole emails in Afrikaans. The first time I did it they were like :001_huh: how did you do that? It's fun! :D

[Pencil Pusher]

Really? Will he still be learning proper English if I'm homeschooling him in Papiamento?

He can't help but do so.

[TeacherZee]

I don't have an answer for you, but a somewhat similar situation. My husband speaks only German to our children and I speak only English to them. My son outright rejects to speak German. He does go along with the German instruction my husband does with him in the evenings, but other than that he not only shows no interest, he is very negative about it.

I think it is a wonderful opportunity to learn another language especially if one happens to live with a native speaker. But I can't convince my 6 year old of that. And I feel bad for my husband because he is sensitive and I think it hurts his feelings.

So I don't know. :confused:

That is good to know! I will tell my DH. :001_smile:

What really forced me to start using English was going to the country. No one understood me when I spoke my first language. Also no one said anything bad when I was trying different words.