History and a 6th grader...what to do?

[Pensguys]

We're using History Odyssey this year for my older ds. He says he hates history. (He isn't overly fond of any school work but he specifically said history the other day.) When I questioned him on why was he listening to SOTW4 on CD the other night, he said "I like that history."

I'm not completely "stuck" on HAVING to follow the WTM cycles, but I've been just going along with it since we've been doing it all along. I really lean more toward the LCC way of doing things.

So, my question is....how should I approach history next year? I had planned on going to HO Level 2 Early Modern, but now I'm not sure. I don't place a huge amount of time/worry into history, but I feel we need to give it a nod a few times/week.

Any suggestions?

[Alana in Canada]

Wait, I'm confused. When he said he liked "that" history--did he mean SoTW in general--or modern history in particular? In other words--does he like the subject matter or the format?

[Stirsmommy]

I haven't gotten it yet but I have heard that HO Early Modern Level 2 is more rigorous requiring a bit more of them. Does he like prefer listening to SOTW because he doesn't have to read it or does he prefer the time period it had to the what he is doing? Could he maybe use the AudioBooks for SOTW next year and supplement with extra readers?
Melissa

[WTMindy]

what did he mean by "that history." Does he like SOTW? Modern times?

[kRenee]

Last year at this time, my dd also hated history using HO level 2. I cut out a lot of work and just had her read and do timeline and mapwork. She isn't a history lover anyway. This seemed to be agreeable to her and she is now doing medieval in that same fashion. Just recently I told her I was going to ask her to do a few of the famous people summaries and she seemed okay with that. A little maturity helps a lot.

[freethinkermom]

Ds11 is doing HO Early Modern Level 2 right now. He thinks it is great, but he generally likes history anyway. He does all of it, but every child is different. We schedule in blocks. For three weeks or so he will do history for three hours everyday (along with math, French, and vocab/grammar), then switch off to science, lit, or art for a couple of weeks. It feels so much more relaxed than doing all subjects every day or week. Maybe a change in when and how you do subjects might help more than a change in what you have him study?

If it is the modern time period your son likes, then I suggest just jumping straight to that. If it is the story telling style, then take a look at The Story Of Mankind which is the main HO text. My son barely tolerated SOTW, but he enjoys TSOM.

[OhElizabeth]

Pen, How about if you take him to a convention this year, let him look at all the history options, and let him decide? It sounds like you've given up the parts he likes about history (the flow of stories, etc.) while trying to streamline and increase the work. He might find one that brings back what he likes but retains what you want. It might not be a bad idea to consider getting into a traditional curriculum series, say BJU, for history. Some of the books are engagingly written. (But you know me, BJU is always my default until I find something I like better.)

[Pensguys]

That is a good question, everyone....I'm not sure. I'll talk to him today and let you know. That will give me a good idea where to go (time period or storytelling format).

He is reading The Story of Mankind when it is assigned and I have already cut out some of the writing (lessened it in some cases; cut out in others). He has always loved to just read the Usborne and Kingfisher books, but I think because the assignments in HO2 can be rather long sometimes or require more of him than he wants to do, he is balking.

I'll ask him today if it is the time period though and let you all know so we can figure out where to go from here.

[Pensguys]

I just asked him and he said he liked listening to history (no specific time period0 on the CDs.

I'm not opposed to him doing that (obviously), but at his age/grade, I think he needs a little more than just listening to SOTW.

[Hoggirl]

Even if you didn't use all of her curricula, her audio CDs are extremely engaging. In themselves, they would not be complete (she also has a text that has LOTS of additional assignments as well as suggested additional books). However, they would be a great supplement if you chose not to use all of her materials. I am trying to decide how *much* of her stuff I want to use next year, but we will definitely use the audios.
Just a thought!:)
Cynthia

[Heather in VA]

I just asked him and he said he liked listening to history (no specific time period0 on the CDs.

I'm not opposed to him doing that (obviously), but at his age/grade, I think he needs a little more than just listening to SOTW.

Well as you know I don't consider history to be as central as WTM makes it but I do think by 6th grade it needs to be more than just listen to SOTW. It sounds to me like he's balking at HO because of the workload. Personally the workload is something that appeals to me about HO. A 6th grader needs to be writing and processing his work rather than just listening to it.

So I'd suggest going through HO and deciding what work is required and what isn't. Does he need to outline? Probably not, unless it's in preparation for a writing assignment. Does he need to do the writing assignments. Probably. Can you give him more time for some assignments?

Unfortunatey sometimes they leave to love something in the casual stage and then get cranky when it becomes more academic. But that's part of life.

Good luck!!

[Linda in NM]

I'm looking forward to our convention--she's coming and presenting. We're happy with Trisms (the research focus is interesting for my son), but we're always looking for audio (currently listening to Shakespeare for Children, SOTW III, and Our Island Story; as well as Vivaldi--our current composer)...for our trips to and fro the rink!

[Pensguys]

Thanks everyone....you've given me some things to think about. Heather in VA, I believe you're right. He always seems so rushed trying to get through his history lessons because he wants to "get done". Then I feel like it sort of becomes busywork.

Since I do lean more toward LCC, I'll have to just take out some stuff and leave in some.

I'll also look at the Diana Waring stuff. Thats Hoggirl for suggesting that.

[OhElizabeth]

Pen, I agree with everyone on the comments about his need to do more than just listen to tapes. A textbook might be helpful in giving you an OBJECTIVE standard that he can't buck against. When you use something ecclectic, it's totally up to you and you're left wondering whether you're requiring too much or too little, whether the author expected too much, etc. When you get something standard like a textbook, something that a normal student should be able to handle, you pass the buck to the curriculum company and tell him sorry, just do it. I'm just observing that you could have a boy/mother thing going. It isn't your job to change history 20 times to make him like it, as he's never going to like work. It's your job to make sure he does the work that builds his writing, research, and study skills. History is really the foil for those, and that's why it has to have the un-fun, academic component.

Guess I'm rambling. I repeat though: make your life easy. Pick something reasonable and don't let him argue over it. If it's something really out there and you're having to add assignments, etc., you're still not going to feel confident. I'd open up to an outside source, somebody else that is the bad guy. Nothing says he can't read history more on his own or listen to SOTW if he likes that so much.

(feeling full of opinions and with minimal experience, except to say that I make our formal history a little grunty and don't sweat it, because I give my dd plenty of time to do it her own way on her own, which she does)

[Heather in VA]

Now gee Elizabeth ..... what great advice!! Where did you hear that before ;)

[Pensguys]

Thanks, OhE. I'm not changing my plans for THIS year at all. He will still continue to follow what I have planned. I was just thinking if there was something else out there that could still cover history but to keep him from not disliking it so much....and again, it is the work that he dislikes.

I'm going to check into BJU like you suggested too.....I meant to say that earlier and forgot.

[Hathersage]

If He likes Listening to History you could try A Little History of the World by E.H. Gombrich.

Here's a link to it at Amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/Little-History-World-Collection-UNABRIDGED/dp/078617286X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1202507930&sr=8-1

[Pensguys]

I'll look into that, thanks.

[Pensguys]

Ds says he wants to jump into American history around the time of WWII. That is a lot of history to leave out though inbetween! He has listened to SOTW zillions of times though which is why I think it interests him.

Is there a curriculum about there that just focuses on the wars?

[Heather in VA]

Well if you like the workload and independent setup of History Odyssey you could just use Modern Level II. It's due out this summer. It really is probably better for him to study the wars in context of the time period to get more out of it.

[Pensguys]

Yeah, I've been looking around and that seems to be the only possibility without skipping LOTS of history. Most textbooks I've looked at start Ancients in 6th.

[Pensguys]

Well if you like the workload and independent setup of History Odyssey you could just use Modern Level II. It's due out this summer. It really is probably better for him to study the wars in context of the time period to get more out of it.

I definitely agree....sounds like a plan. I'd like to get the first part of American history in at some point before high school so he may just have to study this in reverse...meaning 7th grade will be Early Modern.

[Heather in VA]

Penny,

I just bought Early Modern Level II, mostly so I could really see it and get an idea of the workload she's expecting from a 7th grader so I can be sure we are ready for Modern Level II next year. It's phenominal. I know she increases the workload as you move from Ancients through Modern (makes sense since you are theoretically going from 5th through 8th grade) so I don't know if the level you currently have has all of this stuff but it's really great.

It's got essay worksheets, including specifics on topic sentences, main ideas for each paragraph etc. Suggestions for Powerpoint presentations (I know not everyone has this but it's something they do in public school so it's nice to have the idea in case you have the software), research assignments, formal essay assignments (after a how to write an essay lesson), compare and contrast assignments etc. It's really good. If you can possibly make him happy with the subject matter but keep this quality of workload, do it. I can't wait to get to this next year.

[Pensguys]

To be frank, I haven't required a lot of the outlining this year, nor a lot of the other writing assignments. I have been doing SOME though so that I could slowly ramp up the quantity of work.

To my credit, he may complain but I don't give in. What is there is there and that is what he does (unless I have determined beforehand that I don't want him to do it).

So are you saying that you feel we need to cover Early Modern II before Modern even though he would rather study Modern II? If so, then I'm fine with doing that. The only subject he says he loves is science (Exploration Education) because of the experiments/hands on part, so he won't like much of anything else I pick for other subjects either, so if you think we need to do EMII first, then we'll go that way.

[Heather in VA]

So are you saying that you feel we need to cover Early Modern II before Modern even though he would rather study Modern II? If so, then I'm fine with doing that. The only subject he says he loves is science (Exploration Education) because of the experiments/hands on part, so he won't like much of anything else I pick for other subjects either, so if you think we need to do EMII first, then we'll go that way.

No, I'm not saying that you can't skip right to Modern. I just mean that judging from what I see here in Early Modern, I expect Modern to have similar work requirements and expect to be very pleased with it. I don't know how much outlining there is in the one you are using but I'm seeing less outlining and more paragraph and essay writing in this level. I'd be inclined to skip outlining but these writing assignments are quite good. By all means do Modern next year. I just thought I'd encourage you to stick with HO because it really does seem to be a sound academic approach without making history the only thing you have time for.



PS - did you see Elizabeth's news??

[Pensguys]

No, I'm not saying that you can't skip right to Modern. I just mean that judging from what I see here in Early Modern, I expect Modern to have similar work requirements and expect to be very pleased with it.

PS - did you see Elizabeth's news??

Gotcha! ;)

Yes! She emailed me the other day. I'm so happy for her!