Science Fairs?!?! (Possibly just a vent, but questions included!)

[Annie N]

We have a book about how to do science fairs and are putting together experiments for a very small one.

This book is unreal in what seem to be the expectations! They expect you to thoroughly research the question, at which point you know the answer, don't you? In which case, it's not really an experiment? I'm not clear on this part of it.

The other thing is that the author recommends a really high level of work: journal, report (with title page, table of contents, intro, and etc), abstract, and display, the experiments recommended in the very same book are... well, not up to the level of what she recommends! For example, there is discussion about writing to someone to get info, but the projects are along this level: using a rubber-band–spool combo to make something go, forming "dew" on the outside of a very cold glass of water.

It's so all over the place that I feel lost! Like, these experiments seem to be for younger children, but the work for high schoolers. What do science fair judges actually expect from children at different ages? (Wouldn't you know that I currently have one in every age group!)

I guess that my question is, what is the purpose of a science fair?

And the other thing is, how on earth does one sort out what to help the child with and what to allow/require the child to do on his own?

:eek::eek::eek:

[Jean in Newcastle]

I have friends who have kids in a school that has a science fair every year. The point of the experiments seems to be to show or "prove" to others a scientific principle or fact - not to actually find something out. So yes, you would go into it knowing the answer from your research.

I don't know what science fair judges expect - do they publish a book of guidelines or something?

In my df's experience: the kindergarten science fair project was about animals in their habitat - they made a paper mache polar bear and put it on some styrofoam ice. The report was a couple of sentences about polar bears and their habitat.

1st grade project was still animals in their habitat - this time they made a panda bear out of paper mache! Similar report (but slightly longer).

3rd grade project - was showing friction using marbles and something else (blocks I think) going down an inclined plane. The report explained friction and why the different materials acted the way they did.

4th grade project - was make simple electricity circuits (lamp, buzzer - stuff like that). The report explained circuits and the difference between closed and open circuits.

5th grade project - something to do with physics - I don't know what they've decided. Df just went to the library to pick up some physics books for kids.

[Annie N]

Oh, Jean, thanks so much! Your first paragraph really clarified the process, and thanks so much for the examples--they are very helpful.

Of course, we did it all backwards... but at this point, none of us cares :)

[KAR120C]

My favorite science projects of DS's have been those that took something known (like what baking soda does with acids and what it does with some colors) and applies it to something that was never specified (like what it will do with paint). In the baking soda experiment, he had to research what baking soda does (reading, doing "kit" projects from the toy store, etc.) and then use what he knew from that to make a hypothesis about what would happen with paint. His hypothesis was that "if the paint is acidic it will foam, and it might change color" (which wasn't too bad for a six year old... LOL) And then he tested it on the paint. It didn't do a darn thing, but he knew why -- it wasn't acidic, and apparently it's not the type of coloring that changes color with pH. By the end of the project he was super-clear on pH and the vinegar/baking soda reaction (not just acid/base, but acid/carbonate), knew how to use several types of pH paper and which ones would work best with something heavily colored like paint, and was at least moderately clear on the thing where some colors, apparently mainly those in fruits and veggies, are indicators of a sort and will change color with changes in pH.

So for us, it isn't necessarily about finding out something completely new as much as it is about coming up with a good way of testing known facts against unknown (and interesting!) situations using a reliable procedure and good data collection. This year's project was more sophisticated but actually not quite as good... It involved understanding air resistance/drag and testing it against leaves falling, but while the whole thing was fascinating, he didn't do as good a job communicating all the research he did first, or describing his procedure, or emphasizing the reliability. So his conclusions weren't quite as solid as they have been in previous projects, and the judging reflected that extremely accurately... by which I mean he didn't win, but there was an excellent reason! ;)

I posted something on the old boards about how much to help... which I'll cut-and-paste here.....

If it's just for fun/ exhibition, then I wouldn't worry too much about what help you give, except insofar as you make sure to leave the decision-making to him so that it is his project! I'm always amazed at how different DS's projects are from what I would do in the same situation. :)

If it's competitive, then I'd be much more careful that he did all his own work (including the tedious parts!) Writing is sort of a gray area for me -- I wouldn't interfere much with the composition (although I do feel free to take my red pen to whatever DS does...) but the physical act of writing I think you can help as much as is needed... For us, once DS moved up to the competitive level I did make him do his own writing/typing (with the extra benefit that all that practice greatly improved his handwriting and typing speed!) Actually I made it a condition of moving up, since he wanted to switch to competitive when he was younger than the recommended age.

So my job now is to help him stay on track. He has to:
--come up with the project
--find books and articles to read (and read them!)
--come up with a hypothesis based on his reading
--design an experiment
--carry it out (with help for dangerous work or things he just can't reach... LOL)
--collect and organize his data
--make a conclusion based on his data
--write up the whole thing

The things I think you can do for a younger kid are helping with the reading and helping with the writing.

For a kid who has no experience with research, you will probably have to teach them (without doing for them) how to find books and articles, how a hypothesis is developed, how an experiment is designed, and how data can be collected and organized. I would not interfere at all with choosing a project, choosing a hypothesis, or making the conclusion. And I really prefer, when I'm helping with carrying out the experiment, for DS to have given me explicit instructions (e.g. "hang a 1-foot-long string from a pin in the ceiling; set up the tripod and the camera on top of the coffee table; move the sofa and put the step ladder in front of the window") to make it abundantly clear that I'm the lovely assistant and not the decision maker.

My major interference is in the schedule. This was the first year that DS came up with his own timeline of what needed to be done and when, but I'm still the enforcer ;) It usually goes "You know it's two weeks to the science fair and you still have a blank board and you're three days behind your own schedule. If you don't get cracking you are not going to be done in time!"

As far as the level and type, I would completely leave it up to him! Whatever question he wants to answer and however much work he's ready to put into it will pretty much answer that for you ;)

Hope this helps!!

[Krista in LA]

I don't know if all science fairs are the same. I think the purpose of them is to get kids interested in science and give them practice in using the scientific method. Ours stressed using the scientific method and making sure that your project was something that you could measure. It did require research (which didn't necessarily tell us the answers in our case), a journal which basically included all of their notes and data collected, a report which summarized everything, an abstract which was simply a form that had to be filled out that was basically a paragraph about the project, and a display board with everything on it. In addition, there was a judges' interview where the kids gave a presentation and the judges asked them questions. In our fair, just demonstrating something was not going to do well.

My dd, who was 10 at the time, decided to find out which type of orange juice (fresh, reconstituted frozen, canned, or from a plastic jug) had the most vitamin C in it. Her research included finding out about vitamin C. The judge was quite impressed with her when he asked not only what illness can you get from not having enough vitamin C, but what are some of the symptoms of it and she was able to answer him confidently. She also researched how to make an indicator solution to perform her test. She hypothesized that the fresh would have the most but found that the frozen did. This did not hurt her in the judging because everything she did was valid and she was able to explain why she thought the fresh would have more and her theory on why the frozen actually did. I think the thing that helped her the most was knowing her project inside and out - one of the judges said he was blown away by her presentation.

As far as how much you can help and how much they should do, I think that depends somewhat on the age of the child. For my dd's project, I supervised to make sure that she was doing things properly, I answered questions for her when she had them, and I made sure that she had done enough research. Oh, I took pictures of her too. She picked out her project, researched it on the web, made a list of what she needed, shopped for them (trying to buy the same brands of orange juice when possible and not buying ones with added calcium, etc), made the indicator solution, juiced an orange, reconstituted the frozen juice, measured out the juices, tested the juices, typed her report, made her display board, etc. My ds was only 7 at the time when he did his so I had to help him more, but still, the work was his.

HTH. Science fairs can be a lot of fun. I wish our homeschool group still did one.

[Sebastian (a lady)]

She hypothesized that the fresh would have the most but found that the frozen did. This did not hurt her in the judging because everything she did was valid and she was able to explain why she thought the fresh would have more and her theory on why the frozen actually did. I think the thing that helped her the most was knowing her project inside and out - one of the judges said he was blown away by her presentation.

I was a judge for our science fair last year. There is no problem at all with the hypothesis being proven wrong. In fact that is great. It is even better if the student can explain why they think the experiment showed something better (this just rolls into a new hypothesis that can be further tested). I like to ask questions about why they chose to test their hypothesis a certain way, how would they test a new hypothesis, what do they wish they'd done instead, and what they would like to do next to further the idea.

For the parental help, it depends on the age of the child and the project. But I'd rather see something that the child fully understands and can explain (like lung capacity using a two liter bottle and rubber tubing to expell water from the bottle) than a more abstract experiment that the child can't explain. I was also bothered by one presentation where there was a gizmo that was supposed to demonstrate the experiment that wasn't working. One of the parents took over trying to make it work while the other was making less than helpful comments to the girl presenting. I was standing there wishing that the parents would just wander off so I could talk to the girl about what she'd done and what she'd learned.

[Annie N]

This is all so helpful. I really appreciate it, and Erica, I think your explanation of helping should be enshrined somewhere. I'm going to keep a copy of all the responses for next year :) in the cover of that book! so that I won't forget!

[KAR120C]

Glad to help!! :)