Tips on developing "cheerful first time obeyers" needed

[aly9712]

Alright, my just turned 4 year old is starting to give me a run for my money.
Any tips on how to correct these behaviors (with the exception of spankings) are appreciated. We do virtue trainings daily and read our Bible.

1. Becomes highly fustrated when unable to do something and throws an absolute fit (ex. can't figure out puzzle, can't write a specific letter). I need a way to pull her out of her perfectionist mode.

2. Takes multiple requests or just ignores them until I threaten with a time out, and trust me, the cheerfulness is NOT there.

3. The one that makes me the most dissapointed- will raise her voice or tell me what she's not going to do, at times.

thanks,
a tired mom in VA.

[st_claire]

How about some role play? Get some dolls or toys and go over the scenarios that cause these problems. Let her be the mom and you be her. Let her see what behavior s expected.

Try and warning followed by time out. When she does a behavior you don't like, get down at her eye level. Calmly look her in the eyes and tell her what she is doing that is not ok and what you would like her to do instead. Tell her that this is a warning and that if she doesn't do as she is asked, she will get a time out. If the warning doesn't work, put her in time out. 1 minute per year of age seems to be good. have a specific spot for a time out, like a chair in the living room, or sitting on the steps. After the time out is over, ask her to apologize and then give her hugs and let her know you love her.

Hope these ideas help :)

[True Blue]

She's 4. Sounds pretty normal to me. She may just be a little more challenging. Are you trying to homeschool her right now? Could she be frustrated because she's not ready?

[Joanne]

While I don't believe in *cheerful* obedience, I do expect my children to obey with respect. (In this context, respect means without whining or attitude).

Here is how I teach my kids that, without spanking:

http://goybparenting.com/?page_id=40

[True Blue]

I missed that the little girl was talking back or throwing fits. I never expected cheerful obedience either. A lot of my parenting techniques when they were little was prevention. Reading the cues of a storm coming and trying to head it off. I like your site btw.

[Pamela H in Texas]

Did you see the recent thread about this? I'll see if I can find it and link it. I think you'll find some good tips in there. :)

ETA -- here is the thread: http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showthread.php?t=31014&highlight=time+obedience

HTHs,

[Jean in Newcastle]

Alright, my just turned 4 year old is starting to give me a run for my money.
Any tips on how to correct these behaviors (with the exception of spankings) are appreciated. We do virtue trainings daily and read our Bible.

1. Becomes highly fustrated when unable to do something and throws an absolute fit (ex. can't figure out puzzle, can't write a specific letter). I need a way to pull her out of her perfectionist mode.

2. Takes multiple requests or just ignores them until I threaten with a time out, and trust me, the cheerfulness is NOT there.

3. The one that makes me the most dissapointed- will raise her voice or tell me what she's not going to do, at times.

thanks,
a tired mom in VA.

Consistency is the key to first-time obedience - on the part of the parents. I think it could be also named "first-time consequence"!

1. I don't deal with frustration in the same way because I don't think it is disobedience. I teach my dc to take a deep breath and ask for help. This is a long on-going process. If they ignore my gentle help, and still spiral out of control, then I put them into time-out (or whatever works in your house) so that they can regain control.

2. Give one request and at first- couple that with a reminder that there will be a time-out if that request isn't obeyed. Ie. "Junior, I want you to pick up your blocks. If you don't pick up your blocks the first time, I will put you in time out." Then if Jr. doesn't obey, you need to give that first-time consequence! This step is the one that needs 99.9% consistency from you (we all goof sometimes - but the more we goof the less likely the child is to learn this lesson quickly).

3. Raising her voice or saying no - is open defiance. Tell your child, "You may not speak to me like that. I asked you to obey." Then put her into time-out - every single time she does this.

[Philothea]

Everyone else has such great ideas.

Please do not think that you are asking too much out of your child. We too, try to develop the virtue of obedience in our children.

My favorite thing to do is to give them little ways to excercise obedience. For example, putting back a toy in the store that they really want, giving me or a sibling a piece of their candy, also just doing little tasks like getting something for me or whatever else even though they want to do something else.

We've known that we wanted them to be obedient since they were little so we have trained them in this regard. However, I do find that big things, sometimes do require more work and discipline-- like "clean up your toys."

[Pamela H in Texas]

Give one request and at first- couple that with a reminder that there will be a time-out if that request isn't obeyed. Ie. "Junior, I want you to pick up your blocks. If you don't pick up your blocks the first time, I will put you in time out."

I would NEVER do this....

I'm worried about offending you Jean, but that isn't my intent. My intent is solely to share why I wouldn't do this to the OP so she can make her own decision.

The REASON I wouldn't do this is because it allows the child to CHOOSE to disobey. They just have to deal with the consequence. That isn't acceptable in my home. Young children need to obey, not be allowed to choose a punishment instead.

Instead, I would encourage the child to do what was told. This would look different depending on the circumstances and child so I can't say exactly what I would do in each situation or it would take all day. But some choices would be to lead the child to do what was told, to give them a time period by which to be started or finished, to physically aid the child in complying, to make it a game, etc.

It may be a little more difficult for mom temporarily to MAKE it happen, but there are benefits. First, the child complied the first time instead of after a punishment (or a more challenging child, several punishments). Second, the child learned they must comply. Third, the child isn't sitting thinking about mom or time out, but is complying.

Jean, again, I used your post as a jumping off point and I know that what you said, if done consistently works for many children. I just don't think it best for the reasons above and it certainly won't work with many challenging kiddos. My son would have (still would!) choose time out all day long rather than complying. We had to do better.

JMO, YMMV,

[Jean in Newcastle]

I'm not offended! :) Actually, I don't do this in my own home - but that is because the standard was always first-time obedience. So my kids knew what to expect from day one. The reason I suggested this was because I do think if the child is used to the idea that I only have to obey after 3 times when Mom gets really mad and threatens a consequence, that they should have some kind of warning that the standards have changed! It seems only fair. That was all I was getting at. And I would not keep reminding them of the new standards once it became an established pattern in the house.

[Pamela H in Texas]

yes, it's SO much easier when you just follow through with your infants and toddlers so it's a non issue with preschoolers. I always tried to be trustworthy. My kids knew just what to expect, no surprises. It's much easier to teach at 1 or 2 even with a more challenging child that is going to need firm consistency for years. Of course, all is far from lost when we're talking kids in single digits. It just may be a little tougher because the standard is changing.