6.5 year old non-reader--language arts

[angpsmith]

I have 2 older girls who started reading at preschool age, so when we began "first" grade, we were able to go right into English grammar and spelling.

I have a 6.5 year old son that I haven't spent nearly as much time with him (teaching) over the past couple of years as I did with the girls (due to lots of time spent on medical issues with my younger daughter). I feel bad, and now feel the need to "catch up".

I am going to begin him this summer with OPGtTR. I don't know how far we will get. My question is this: What is the earliest point in OPG you would recommend starting Grammar and Spelling? (I will be using FLL and Spelling Workout)

I don't want to start him too early, but at the same time, I know we will need to start before I did with the older girls (They both finished OPG just before they turned 6, and then we started SW and FLL soon after they turned 6.) This worked great for them, but in order to not get too far behind, we are going to have to start ds on grammar and spelling before he gets all the way through OPG, I just don't know when??? Any advice? Thanks!

[chiguirre]

My first grader was only reading CVC words at the beginning of this year. I've been using Learning Language Arts Through Literature Blue Level and the Pathway readers to teach reading and some very basic grammar and mechanics. We also use Explode the Code (1, 2 and 3 this year) for phonics and spelling. Although it's not formally a spelling program it does have exercises where you write the word from memory so it serves that function well.

I plan to start FLL and the Writing With Ease Level 1 Workbook with both kids in August. Ds will be a year behind, but we'll eventually catch up over summers. I expect dd to be reading CVC words when we start and I think that will be enough (although I might have changed my mind by September).

[Sue G in PA]

I wouldn't even worry about FLL until he is reading well. We don't do formal grammar here until 3rd (we tried FLL 1/2 and it bombed...my dc just weren't auditory learners). You could easily skip FLL 1/2 and move into FLL3 when he is in 3rd w/out any problems, IMO. I would second LLATL, though. I use the Red (2nd grade) w/ ds6 (almost 7) and it's "just enough" grammar, spelling, phonics, writing for him (pencil phobic!) each day. But really...get him reading well. Does he know letters/sounds? ETC primers are a very fun intro. to that as are the ETC books 1-8 (my ds8 wouldn't agree at this point, but *I* think they are useful!).

[angpsmith]

I'm sorry...I thought I had said in the original post....
he knows all letter sounds and can put together short vowel words (if walked through them one letter at a time)...

I don't have experience with LLATL but I may check it out.

[Sue G in PA]

I just read in your original post that you were concerned about him getting "behind" in grammar and spelling. Behind how or whom? Each child develops and learns at their own pace...of course you know that so I'm not telling you anything new! I just wanted to encourage you that he is not and will not be "behind". My ds8 was a late reader due to a complete and total lack of interest. But, once he wanted to learn..he did it quickly and is now reading far beyond grade level. My ds5 is just now taking an interest in doing actual "schoolwork". For the first time today, he actually ASKED to do schoolwork! Yeah! My dd11...was reading at 3. My dd2...already knows her letters and majority of sounds. See, they are all different. I don't worry...especially about grammar and spelling. They learn so much about proper sentence structure, capitalization, punctuation, nouns, verbs, etc. through daily reading of good books, talking to intelligent adults, etc. And as for spelling, some programs don't even recommend starting spelling until 3rd grade! It's all relative. Just wanted to encourage you that he isn't going to be "behind". I"m sure somebody else will chime in their .02 as well...this board is full of such wisdom!

[angpsmith]

Well, i guess "behind" isn't really what I meant. I just know that if we wait until we finish OPG to start "anything" else, he really won't be where he should be; yet I hesitate to do anything else at this point, because i REALLY liked my girls reading well before we moved on to other learning. (of course, they have all "learned" along the way, just by the sake of reading, and being read to). Am I making any sense?

Now I'm sounding like I expect him to be exactly like his sisters, aren't I??? I really don't mean that either. I am having a hard time articulating my thoughts.

I'm now looking back at OPG and once we are about half way through, he'll be reading fairly well. So maybe I'll just progress through OPG and look at it again in January or so.

I think I may like the idea of skipping FLL 1/2 and going straight to FLL 3 in 3rd. I hadn't even thought of that. I'm going to ponder that a while.

[Cadam]

Some people don't do any spelling or grammar until 3rd grade, or even later. If he is older when he tarts he will just pick it up faster. I wouldn't do anything until you are on at least lesson 150 of OPG. You could easily wait until later even.

[WABeth]

Here is what the OPGTR FAQ says from the Peace Hill Press site:

My child is using The Ordinary Parent’s Guide to Teaching Reading. At what lesson number do I begin a spelling program, a penmanship program, and First Language Lessons Levels 1 and 2 (the grammar and writing program)?Jessie advises teaching reading, writing, and spelling separately from one another, as they are three separate skills. You don’t want to slow a child’s reading progress just because her fine motor skills are not yet fully developed. And a child always does better spelling words he can easily read and recognize. Reading instruction can begin before spelling and penmanship. Most four- and five-year-olds can learn to read.

There is no set lesson in The Ordinary Parent’s Guide to Teaching Reading at which the child should begin her spelling and penmanship instruction. Generally, the child should be about half-way through the lessons (around Lesson 115). At that point the child can read words with the most common patterns for short-and long-vowel sounds. The words in her spelling and penmanship program will therefore be familiar to her.

You need to be more precise when deciding to start First Language Lessons, since the child is asked to do copywork exercises. The Ordinary Parent's Guide is structured so that the child applies most phonetic rules to single-syllable words (Lessons 1-177). Lesson 178 and following in The Ordinary Parent’s Guide are all multi-syllable words—these lessons reinforce the patterns taught earlier. A few new phonetic patterns are introduced in multi-syllable words, but those patterns are not as common as the patterns taught in earlier lessons. Once the child has completed Lesson 181 in The Ordinary Parent’s Guide, he knows how to read most phonetic patterns, how to sound out the parts of multi-syllable words, and he has been introduced to the schwa sound. He is fully capable of doing copywork.

First Language Lessons for the Well-Trained Mind (Levels 1 and 2) is mostly oral work, although copywork exercises begin in Lesson 42 (and dictation exercises begin later). So by the time the child reaches Lesson 42 in FLL, he should be on or past Lesson 182 in OPG. If you are looking for a lesson by lesson comparison (and you do the same number of grammar and reading lessons per week), you can start FLL when the child in on Lesson 140 in OPG.

Following this suggestion assumes that the child has been practicing penmanship enough to copy names, words, and short sentences. If she can't do the copywork at the end of Lesson 42 (and subsequent lessons where she copies short words and sentences), delay beginning First Language Lessons until her penmanship skills prepare her for this.

[angpsmith]

Thanks Beth! This is great info. I never even thought to check with the PHP site. (My brain only works part-time)