Now I am nervous

[Cadam]

I just volunteered to do supplemental math with all of the advanced 4th graders at dd's school.

I had been kicking around the idea for a while but I was chatting with the teacher when I went to have lunch with dd today and I actually said I would do it. Now I am wondering if I am nuts.

Dd's teacher only has dd and one other advanced math student but there are 2 other 4th grade classes and all of the teachers do their planning together an the classes all have math at the same time each day, so I could pull a group together from all of the 4th grades.

I told her that I wanted to make it less work for her not more and she said she was really excited about the possibilities and would talk to the other teachers. I hope I did the right thing.

If I do this I really hope they will just say "this is what we are doing" and let me pull together the supplemental stuff. I have plenty of resources here and I truly don't like their math program (most of the teacher's agree).

This week dd's teacher had her and the other advanced student making up math problems for each other and really, how could one person be expected to come up with separate work for 2 kids, when she has 27 others who need her attention? I understand that, but I really don't want dd wasting her time everyday.

We would start with once a week I think to see how it would work. Ultimately I think I would need to be there twice a week for them to make any real progress though.

Part of me is excited and thinking about the possibilities of doing enrichment for the 5th graders too, if this works well. Part of me is really, really nervous!

Has anyone else ever helped with pull-out stuff?

[EKS]

I just wanted to say that this is awesome! Those kids are lucky to have you! I would be really interested to hear how it goes and what you decide to do with them.

[LimitBreak]

I am also thinking of doing something like this at my ds school but haven't gone forward with the idea.

Good luck to you and let us know your progress!

[cermincantik]

Good luck:)

[Cadam]

I am starting next Wednesday. I will be there for an hour to do extra work with the advanced kids. I am really excited. I wonder if the kid will still like me if I bring Singapore CWP?:lol:

dd's teacher is going to send some things home with her so that I can see exactly what they are doing in class and build off of that.

I am excited about helping these kids. At least one day a week they won't have to be bored in math class. I really hope I don't screw up!

[Sahamamama]

I am starting next Wednesday. I will be there for an hour to do extra work with the advanced kids. I am really excited. I wonder if the kid will still like me if I bring Singapore CWP?:lol:

dd's teacher is going to send some things home with her so that I can see exactly what they are doing in class and build off of that.

I am excited about helping these kids. At least one day a week they won't have to be bored in math class. I really hope I don't screw up!

This sounds like a wonderful opportunity for you!

From past experience working with advanced students in a school setting (w/Everyday Math in the classroom),:tongue_smilie: I would not try to build off of what they are doing in class. Instead, I would try to find out where the students themselves are in their skills and conceptual understanding, and then build off of that.

It's just been my observation that paying attention to "what they're doing in class" is only going to bog you down, drive you crazy, continue to bore the students, and possibly create a sense of competition with the teachers.

If these students really are advanced, bright, motivated, energetic, and "mathy," then I would simply "go for it!" Sure, take a look at what they're doing in class. :tongue_smilie:But you might just decide to chuck it and lay down your own train track. My two cents.

Have FUN!

[Cadam]

This sounds like a wonderful opportunity for you!

From past experience working with advanced students in a school setting (w/Everyday Math in the classroom),:tongue_smilie: I would not try to build off of what they are doing in class. Instead, I would try to find out where the students themselves are in their skills and conceptual understanding, and then build off of that.

It's just been my observation that paying attention to "what they're doing in class" is only going to bog you down, drive you crazy, continue to bore the students, and possibly create a sense of competition with the teachers.

If these students really are advanced, bright, motivated, energetic, and "mathy," then I would simply "go for it!" Sure, take a look at what they're doing in class. :tongue_smilie:But you might just decide to chuck it and lay down your own train track. My two cents.

Have FUN!




Thanks for the suggestions. Her teacher sent home a TM for a 5th grade math program that is similar tot he one they use. It is Bridges in mathematics. They use TERC Investigations. Both are rather constructivist and use a lot of group activities and games and strange ways of doing things.

However, the TM has a handy chart that shows what the goals are for each grade. THey are rather pitiful goals for the grades (pretty far behind the same "grade" of Singapore) but I can use that to build toward similar goals in my own way using Singapore and MUS or at least make sure the kids can do those things before I take them further.

I am sure you are right that if I try to use their methods I will just be frustrated. I tried to do that with another student I had and there was no end to the stress that caused.

In our first session next week I am going to try and gage where each of the kids are and then make a plan of action to get them into deeper understanding, more complicated word problems and fill in any gaps they have. Basically, I will go through Singapore math with them, do CWP and show them how to use bar diagrams.

If these kids are advanced with a math program that hobbles them they are either very bright or have parents working with them at home. With good instruction I hope they will soar.

How sad that they will only get that once a week though.

If it goes well I may propose adding a second pull-out day in January or February. In my perfect world I would coordinate daily gifted classes with other parents for all grade levels in math and LA.

I guess I better order that next level of Singapore.;)

[Bird Girl]

You could always do model problems during your one-day-a-week, and leave them with a packet of work to do in their classes on the other four days. If you paired CWP with the Intensive Practice book you could generate enough material to make week-long packets.

[Cadam]

You could always do model problems during your one-day-a-week, and leave them with a packet of work to do in their classes on the other four days. If you paired CWP with the Intensive Practice book you could generate enough material to make week-long packets.

If the first few weeks go well I am going to ask about coming in one other day each week and leaving them with work to do. I am waiting to see if dd qualifies for TAG. that will change the way I approach it a little bit.

I'm sure I can't just wholesale copy out of the IP book (not that you were suggesting that) but does anyone know if I can copy CWP because it is OOP? I am spinning around ideas in my head about having a meeting with the parents of the other kids and seeing what we can do. If they are willing to come up with a little money for the IP books I can teach two lessons at a time, twice a week and give the kids assignments to do in their IP books along with some CWP from my OOP books to keep them busy the other days.

Really the question is wether or not these teachers have enough leeway to let me take over the math education of their gifted kids. If I can pull this off it will be amazing, and it will cause headaches for the Jr. High principal in a couple of years :lol: The advanced kids at the Jr. High get to do Pre-Algebra in the 8th grade. What will they do with kids who are ready for algebra in 6th?

[Concerned Mom]

[QUOTE=Sahamamama;2222650]This sounds like a wonderful opportunity for you!

From past experience working with advanced students in a school setting (w/Everyday Math in the classroom),:tongue_smilie: I would not try to build off of what they are doing in class. Instead, I would try to find out where the students themselves are in their skills and conceptual understanding, and then build off of that.

It's just been my observation that paying attention to "what they're doing in class" is only going to bog you down, drive you crazy, continue to bore the students, and possibly create a sense of competition with the teachers.

If these students really are advanced, bright, motivated, energetic, and "mathy," then I would simply "go for it!" Sure, take a look at what they're doing in class. :tongue_smilie:But you might just decide to chuck it and lay down your own train track. My two cents.

Have FUN!

Advanced math was mentioned in the forum. I am wondering what type of advance math is there for a 4th or 3rd grader? I am aware in 3rd grade the students are learning multiplication, division etc.

[Cadam]

[QUOTE=Sahamamama;2222650]This sounds like a wonderful opportunity for you!

From past experience working with advanced students in a school setting (w/Everyday Math in the classroom),:tongue_smilie: I would not try to build off of what they are doing in class. Instead, I would try to find out where the students themselves are in their skills and conceptual understanding, and then build off of that.

It's just been my observation that paying attention to "what they're doing in class" is only going to bog you down, drive you crazy, continue to bore the students, and possibly create a sense of competition with the teachers.



If these students really are advanced, bright, motivated, energetic, and "mathy," then I would simply "go for it!" Sure, take a look at what they're doing in class. :tongue_smilie:But you might just decide to chuck it and lay down your own train track. My two cents.

Have FUN!

Advanced math was mentioned in the forum. I am wondering what type of advance math is there for a 4th or 3rd grader? I am aware in 3rd grade the students are learning multiplication, division etc.


I'm sorry, I don't understand what you are asking. Can you clarify? Do you want a run down of math topics traditionally covered in each grade? Are you trying to figure out how to accelerate math? When dd finished third grade math we just went on to fourth grade math. We finished the 4th grade Singapore book a few weeks ago and I ordered the 5th grade books today. I didn't accelerate her on purpose. In fact, I tried to slow her down (two complete math programs on top of ps work). She just loves math and it comes naturally for her.

In the elementary grades most basic operations are covered each year, just in increasing depth and complexity. With your afterschooling work your son can go as quickly through the material as he is able of course. What exactly is covered depends a great deal on the program you are using.

You might get more answers if you started a thread with your topic in the title.

[Sahamamama]

How was math class?

:bigear:

[Cadam]

How was math class?

:bigear:

Thank you so much for asking! I don't start until the 8th. I will be sure to update though.

[Cadam]

All of the classrooms at dd's school are grouped around "pods" There are tables out there where kids are taken for special reading groups or testing or where they go to eat lunch with a group of friends.

I assumed I would be working with the kids in the pod area but I got an email from dd's teacher today. She reserved me a classroom with real whiteboards and offered to make any photocopies or gather any materials I needed.:eek: wow.

I was worried at the beginning of the year about dd having such a young teacher but she has been nothing less than extremely helpful, kind and accommodating. Dare I hope that this could be the beginning of something great?

[Bird Girl]

Sounds very promising! I wouldn't worry about making copies from CWP, since they are out of print. You could use the Intensive Practice problems for group work or examples to do together if the school can't spring for individual copies for your students.

[Spy Car]

All of the classrooms at dd's school are grouped around "pods" There are tables out there where kids are taken for special reading groups or testing or where they go to eat lunch with a group of friends.

I assumed I would be working with the kids in the pod area but I got an email from dd's teacher today. She reserved me a classroom with real whiteboards and offered to make any photocopies or gather any materials I needed.:eek: wow.

I was worried at the beginning of the year about dd having such a young teacher but she has been nothing less than extremely helpful, kind and accommodating. Dare I hope that this could be the beginning of something great?

Very exciting. I think it's great your teacher (and administration) is open to your helping with math instruction. One thought for you (if you have not done so already) is to skim throughout the MEP Lesson Plan materials. They are free to download, and they have many ideas to get children engaged in the process, as opposed to a teacher just lecturing. If you could find activities that match your topics these sort of fun things might help break the ice.

Bill

[ElizabethB]

Very exciting!! :)

Have you read "The Teaching Gap" by Stigler and Hiebert? It should give you some ideas for how to teach math to a class in an engaging way.

[Concerned Mom]

All of the classrooms at dd's school are grouped around "pods" There are tables out there where kids are taken for special reading groups or testing or where they go to eat lunch with a group of friends.

I assumed I would be working with the kids in the pod area but I got an email from dd's teacher today. She reserved me a classroom with real whiteboards and offered to make any photocopies or gather any materials I needed.:eek: wow.

I was worried at the beginning of the year about dd having such a young teacher but she has been nothing less than extremely helpful, kind and accommodating. Dare I hope that this could be the beginning of something great?

What were some of your concerns about your dd having a young teacher?

[Cadam]

What were some of your concerns about your dd having a young teacher?

Inexperience and a likelihood that should would actually believe in the claims of the math program they use (which she seems to unfortunately). Last year she had a veteran who gave the "smile and nod" treatment to the terrible math and then turned around and actually taught math, not at dd's level.... but real math none the less. Last year's teacher was one of those revered veterans that kids still talk about 20 years later. It is tough to have anyone else.

Thank you for the tips Bill and Elizabeth. I hope that I can give the kids more than enrichment. Enrichment is good but they also need acceleration and a break from the convoluted way TERC does things.

[ElizabethB]

Thank you for the tips Bill and Elizabeth. I hope that I can give the kids more than enrichment. Enrichment is good but they also need acceleration and a break from the convoluted way TERC does things.

:iagree:

"The Teaching Gap" goes into detail about how math is taught in Japan in the upper grades--in ways that are challenging and engaging at the same time. Most of the strategies can only be used in groups, although I did learn a little that can be applied to homeschooling.

[Cadam]

:iagree:

"The Teaching Gap" goes into detail about how math is taught in Japan in the upper grades--in ways that are challenging and engaging at the same time. Most of the strategies can only be used in groups, although I did learn a little that can be applied to homeschooling.

It sounds great. My library doesn't have it so I will have to look elsewhere. Any tips before Wednesday? I am kind of going in blind since I have no idea what level these kids are working at (other than dd of course).

I am going armed with some Singapore books and MUS manipulatives and I will check into Bill's suggestions. I also have a pile of books from the library about teaching gifted kids and just finished "Genius Denied".

As far as I can tell the TAG kids at this school get "in-class differentiation" which can means anything depending on your teacher of course. There is a TAG advocate that I have yet to meet.

They are still working on division so I plan to expand that to much larger division problems and division of decimals and then see where we go from there. I will gage where they are with multiplication too and then probably pull out multi-step word problems, solving equations using bar diagrams,powers, square roots and maybe the Pythagorean theorem for fun.

There is such a range when it comes to gifted kids, I simply won't know what they are capable of until I get in there. It's a good think that all of these years with dd have taught me to think on my feet. I'm just going to have to be prepared for anything.

[ElizabethB]

It sounds great. My library doesn't have it so I will have to look elsewhere. Any tips before Wednesday? I am kind of going in blind since I have no idea what level these kids are working at (other than dd of course).


This (http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2232349&postcount=36) post of KarenAnne's describes it a little.

It is nothing that you would want to do the first few times, but a good goal to work up to, it sounds like a great way to learn math.