quick question about reading

[mo2]

My daughter has always been a struggling reader and I have long suspected dyslexia. I have posted before, you may or may not remember. In any case, this is how she describes her trouble reading: All the letters on the page jump out at her and jumble together. Using papers to cover the lines of text above and below helps, but she still loses her place within the line that she is on. You can see her eyes dart around the page continuously, trying to find her place.

Is this something that one might see with dyslexia, or does this sound like a visual tracking issue or something else? I am inexperienced with all of these things.

Thanks for any help.

[ElizabethB]

It sounds like a visual problem to me.

I would teach the whole family braille (I've always wanted to learn braille!) and try that for a while for reading while you try to fix the vision problems.

[mo2]

It sounds like a visual problem to me.

I would teach the whole family braille (I've always wanted to learn braille!) and try that for a while for reading while you try to fix the vision problems.


Thanks Elizabeth. I guess I need to figure out how to fix the vision problems. Any good resources?

I also always wanted to learn braille, ever since I read the Little House series and Mary went blind!

[siloam]

My daughter has always been a struggling reader and I have long suspected dyslexia. I have posted before, you may or may not remember. In any case, this is how she describes her trouble reading: All the letters on the page jump out at her and jumble together. Using papers to cover the lines of text above and below helps, but she still loses her place within the line that she is on. You can see her eyes dart around the page continuously, trying to find her place.

Is this something that one might see with dyslexia, or does this sound like a visual tracking issue or something else? I am inexperienced with all of these things.

Thanks for any help.

You are not the only one who is confused.

It is one of two things, either it is a visual problem in which case you want to see a Developmental Optometrist (check out COVD (http://www.covd.org/) to find one) for vision therapy (VT). Or it is a processing problem in which case it is dysleixa based and you probably would be best to be evaluated by an Irlen (http://irlen.com/index.php) tester and get some filters for her to use when reading.

Either way this probably isn't going to be a cheap adventure. I paid for VT for my 10yo thinking that both her and my problems were with the eyes, she didn't improve. We truly have a processing problem which is dyslexia. The hard part is that it takes a really on top of it specialist to tell the difference, and VT is so new that there are very few. In fact right now the pendulum is swing towards the side where most deny that dyslexia even exists. They believe that they all have an physical problem with eye teaming, tracking or something similar. But I have seen a few acknowledge there are two separate issues, and that if the problem is one of how the brain is processing the information then there is nothing that VT can do to help.

I have other processing symptoms though, that are not effect by eyesight. For example how I can flip directions in my mind. I don't mean remembering which is left or right, I mean I will walk out my door, climb in the car, and head to the grocery story (which I have been too 100 times) and I will turn the opposite direction I need to go because my brain is having a processing problem at that moment and it tells me to do the opposite of what I need to do. It flips the entire map of the area in my mind. I also have recall problems, especially with names, and the longer I have known someone the better the chance I will have a problem.

If this is the only symptom of dyslexia your dd is has then it is very likely that it is a vision issues that can be solved by VT.

Heather

[Laurie4b]

It's not that uncommon for people to report that the words move. Sometimes that is due to high contrast between the white page and the black letters, and to not enough white space on the page for the child's developmental level. My sister had this problem and one day discovered that she could read better at the beach--because she was wearing sunglasses! Irlen overlays can help this, or you can save yourself the $$ and go to an office supply store and get some different colored transparencies and see if any help.

Our ds didn't say the words moved, but he had very severe eye tracking problems. His first round of OT actually took care of most of the tracking issues even though they didn't do anything to work directly on vision--just on getting his sensory problems addressed and his neurological system calmed down and more organized. We later did do vision therapy, and the kind we did addressed both issues of tracking, etc. as well as visual processing problems.

Before his problems were remediated enough, I made a view finder by cutting a piece of white cardstock in half so that it was about the size of a page in a book and about 1/3 of the way down, cutting a narrow window the size of one line of text. He would have the hole towards the top when he started on a page and then partway down flip it. This kept nearly all the page covered all the time. As his tracking improved with OT, he eventually said he didn't need it anymore.

Check out the book the Out of Sync Child and see if your dd fits any of the criteria for sensory processing issues. If so, I'd recommend that you go the OT route first, or do it simultaneously with vision therapy if you can stand it. (A lot of therapies can wear. you. out.) Developmental optometrists do vision therapy. A lot of other professionals think it's hooey, but some people do report benefitting from it. I think it helped my ds somewhat with the visual processing, though I did Brainware Safari at the same time, and I am inclined to think that that helped the most. Ds still has a tendency to skip words or lines, but he catches himself now.

[microcarter]

My ds has dyslexia, dysgraphia & sees an OT for motor planning & motor coordination issues. What you are describing sounds more like visual difficulties. However, it is entirely possible to have both visual difficulties & a language processing problem such as dyslexia. If your child has both problems addressing only one will not help.

While a Developmental Optometrist can tell you if your child needs vision therapy, he will NOT be able to tell you whether or not your child is dyslexic. Vision therapy does not work for dyslexia; it works for vision difficulties.

Here is one of the best site I have found about dyslexia: http://www.brightsolutions.us/ . It takes a lot of time to go through all of the info but well worth it. The webcasts are wonderful. It will help you determine whether you need to pursue testing for dyslexia or if this seems to be an entirely visual issue.

Angie

[siloam]

Irlen overlays can help this, or you can save yourself the $$ and go to an office supply store and get some different colored transparencies and see if any help.

Actually I would highly disagree with that. I have overlays that were sold in this vision therapy package (http://www.howtolearn.com/ireadisucceed.html). They do not have the same effect as my Irlen filters. The glare from the overlays reverses all the benefits the color gives. If you want a cheap way to try them out I would recommend you buy her book (http://www.amazon.com/Reading-Colors-Revised-Helen-Irlen/dp/0399531564/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272653778&sr=8-2) which I am told includes a set of filters. The Irlen filters have a non-glare surface that make all the difference in the world, for me.

Heather

[mo2]

Thanks for the suggestions. I will look into those filters. If only there were a way to know for sure without spending a bunch of money....

[ElizabethB]

Thanks Elizabeth. I guess I need to figure out how to fix the vision problems. Any good resources?

I also always wanted to learn braille, ever since I read the Little House series and Mary went blind!

I have wanted to learn braille since I read Helen Keller!

The closest school for the blind should be able to help, you could get started with the alphabet from this book, I recently found it at our local library:

http://www.amazon.com/Picture-Book-Louis-Braille-Biography/dp/0823414132/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1272873651&sr=8-1

One of the last pages had the alphabet, my daughter and I had fun learning how to read "cat" in braille. (They just list the alphabet, we taught ourselves c, a, and t, and then tested each other on the word cat.)

Your librarian might know how to access other braille material.

[laundrycrisis]

Our 7 yo just finished about three months of vision therapy. He had amblyopia (lazy eye) that was corrected by patching, but his eyes still did not work well as a team, and had poor muscular control, and he had some severe vision problems as a result. The results of the vision therapy have been pretty amazing. Kindy and early grade 1-level school work that used to take him over an hour to do now takes him about ten minutes, and he is finally making some progress. It's been a huge relief.

We had no insurance coverage for the vision therapy and it was expensive - about $80 per weekly 1-hour session; and it was a lot of work, with him doing about 20-30 minutes a day of work at home that was pretty intense. It was completely worth it though. The progress he's made and how much it's improved the experience of learning for him is wonderful. I know there are no guarantees it will work in all cases, but a COVD optometrist should be able to do screening tests beforehand to determine if the problem is something vision therapy can help.

This website has a little example of what text might look like to a child who has an eye tracking/teaming problem:
http://www.childrensvision.com/

If this helps, our son's symptoms (some of which were only revealed by the psychomotor exam) were double vision up close; fuzziness in the center of his vision field; an inability to track across a line of text and back to the start of the next line, or to find his place vertically on the page; an inability to see the spacing between words, or the different proportions of letters; and reversals of letters and numbers. Basically looking at a printed page made little to no sense to him, and he could not make his eyes behave themselves to get anything to stay in focus, in proportion, or in its place. Attempting to read or write was a miserable, frustrating experience for him. His first optometrist, who diagnosed the amblyopia, did not pick up on any of these problems once the lazy eye was able to see with a lens. We had to go to a COVD optometrist to have the right tests done to identify these problems.

[Laurie4b]

My ds has dyslexia, dysgraphia & sees an OT for motor planning & motor coordination issues. What you are describing sounds more like visual difficulties. However, it is entirely possible to have both visual difficulties & a language processing problem such as dyslexia. If your child has both problems addressing only one will not help.

While a Developmental Optometrist can tell you if your child needs vision therapy, he will NOT be able to tell you whether or not your child is dyslexic. Vision therapy does not work for dyslexia; it works for vision difficulties.

Here is one of the best site I have found about dyslexia: http://www.brightsolutions.us/ . It takes a lot of time to go through all of the info but well worth it. The webcasts are wonderful. It will help you determine whether you need to pursue testing for dyslexia or if this seems to be an entirely visual issue.

Angie

The problem is that the word "dyslexia" is used different ways by different people. Right now, many professionals are moving to use the word only for a disorder with phonemic awareness at its core. However, not everyone uses the term that way. I had a developmental optometrist (aka vision therapist) declare that my ds was/was not (can't even remember) dyslexic after giving him a list of words to read. Sorry, but the real diagnostic tests are more comprehensive than that. However, if you naively visited this person, you would be told that your child was x kind of dyslexic, y kind of dyslexic, or not dyslexic. It ticked me off because I know that the process of a real diagnosis is much more complicated.

People will also say that "dyslexia is not about visual issues." This neglects the fact that some kids do indeed have vision issues that impact their reading. Right now, there is virtually no research on how to help kids like that.

[Geo]

.

[Geo]

You are not the only one who is confused.

It is one of two things, either it is a visual problem in which case you want to see a Developmental Optometrist (check out COVD (http://www.covd.org/) to find one) for vision therapy (VT). Or it is a processing problem in which case it is dysleixa based and you probably would be best to be evaluated by an Irlen (http://irlen.com/index.php) tester and get some filters for her to use when reading.

Either way this probably isn't going to be a cheap adventure. I paid for VT for my 10yo thinking that both her and my problems were with the eyes, she didn't improve. We truly have a processing problem which is dyslexia. The hard part is that it takes a really on top of it specialist to tell the difference, and VT is so new that there are very few. In fact right now the pendulum is swing towards the side where most deny that dyslexia even exists. They believe that they all have an physical problem with eye teaming, tracking or something similar. But I have seen a few acknowledge there are two separate issues, and that if the problem is one of how the brain is processing the information then there is nothing that VT can do to help.

I have other processing symptoms though, that are not effect by eyesight. For example how I can flip directions in my mind. I don't mean remembering which is left or right, I mean I will walk out my door, climb in the car, and head to the grocery story (which I have been too 100 times) and I will turn the opposite direction I need to go because my brain is having a processing problem at that moment and it tells me to do the opposite of what I need to do. It flips the entire map of the area in my mind. I also have recall problems, especially with names, and the longer I have known someone the better the chance I will have a problem.

If this is the only symptom of dyslexia your dd is has then it is very likely that it is a vision issues that can be solved by VT.

Heather


:iagree:

Years ago I met a woman (mid 30's) who had reading difficulties since childhood. She had thought she was dyslexic...until she heard of Irlen Syndrome. Long story short, she only needed a color overlay/filter for the letters to "lay down and stop moving". No problems reading when using the overlay/filter. I have no idea if this could be your daughter's problem, but it warrants looking into. Here is a link that lets you test different visual symptoms of IS. See if she can relate to any of them. Check out the rest of the site to learn more about IS and how to get help.

http://irlen.com/distortioneffects.php (http://irlen.com/distortioneffects.php) *Oops, I see Siloam already imbedded a link into her post.

Geo

[laundrycrisis]

I found this thread comparing Irlen and vision therapy...it might be helpful:

http://www.welltrainedmind.com/forums/archive/index.php/t-7262.html