How much is too much? College loans... (Crosspost)

[mom2abcd]

Ds has been accepted to three colleges and today received his first financial aid package. The university costs $35,000/year, but after scholarships, grants, etc. the loan amount would be $18,600 for the first year.

($10,000 of that is a Fedearal PLUS loan which it says creditworthy parents can get... Dh is heading back to graduate school himself so we will both be working part-time and have NO money to help ds. We've always said the kids will have to take care of their college costs themselves, as I did.)

Now the university may find some funds when they know for sure that our income will be lower. But I don't know that.

My question is: How much is too much for a kid to take on as college loans? I know couples who would have liked for the wife to be a stay-at-home mom, but feel she needs to work to pay back loans. I'd hate for ds to get in this situation (and I realize we don't know if his future wife will have loans).

Ds plans to be a civil engineer so he will hopefully make pretty good money. He plans to graduate in four years and then live simply to get everything paid back ASAP. But $74,000 in loans?! It seems like too much.

How much were your college loans and how long did it take to pay them back? Mine were $1,500 and I paid it back my first year of teaching.

How much is too much?

[JenneinAZ]

How much is too much really depends on the person.

But we had about $100,000 in loans between my husband and I. It is not paid off now after 15 years. We hope to be done with them by January 2009.

The important thing to remember is that the best financial aid packages are given to FRESHMEN. The amount of scholarship vs. loan changes as the student progresses. As a senior I had very little scholarship money (like $1000) as a freshman that number was about $10,000.

The school wanted me to attend and then knew that I wouldn't transfer away even I needed to take out loans. And they were correct.

Good luck!

[Michelle in AL]

When I got married, my husband's student loans totaled around $75,000 and were financed over 10yrs at a low interest rate. This was 12 yrs ago, and we paid $1200/month. That's the same as a house payment. He made a good salary, but we felt really behind. For the 10yrs we paid back the loans, we always felt we were behind where we should be in savings. We strongly felt we should save for retirement and the kid's college. We tried to save 8-10%/yr. This left less than we wanted to live on. We lived in a modest home, but there were no vacations, only one car payment at a time, very little clothing allowance and it was a struggle. It was especially hard to watch all our friends live an easy life, while we constantly scrimped. For his career, he really should've been able to live easily, but with loan payments and savings, it wasn't possible. You feel really defeated when you work so hard, and get no extras.
I would say I would have had to work during that time if he had made less than $110,000. Consider that was 12 yrs ago, and the cost of living was much less.

It was so hard for us. It was so hard, we swore not to let our kids be burdened by it.

We also learned that "where" you went to school means little in actually obtaining a job (at least in medicine). So an expensive college just isn't always worth it. This could be different for engineering.

We also learned that less prestigious schools sometimes have easier classes. This can allow you to get a better GPA and which in turn gets you into post grad schools more easily. It's better to be in the top 1/3 of your class at a state school then to be in the bottom 1/3 of a prestigious school where you're competing with "the best of the best."

I wish you luck, it's a hard decision!
Michelle in AL

[Pegasus]

Everyone has to make these choices for themselves but I would be doing my best to persuade my DC to find a less expensive school: state universities or even community college for the basic courses and then transferring.

Pegasus

[Eliana]

We also learned that "where" you went to school means little in actually obtaining a job (at least in medicine). So an expensive college just isn't always worth it. This could be different for engineering.

We also learned that less prestigious schools sometimes have easier classes. This can allow you to get a better GPA and which in turn gets you into post grad schools more easily. It's better to be in the top 1/3 of your class at a state school then to be in the bottom 1/3 of a prestigious school where you're competing with "the best of the best."


I chipped in my .02 on the other board, but I wanted to respond to this part of your post, Michelle.

Where you go for your undergraduate degree can, in some fields, dramatically influence where you can hope to get in to a graduate program... and being in the top third at a school known to be less rigorous will never serve a student in good stead. Degrees from schools known for their quality really can mean something - both in graduate school applications and in the job market. (A chem professor I know won his position in part because of his Harvard degree - he wasn't the only fabulous candidate applying, but his degree really meant something, both in his initial hiring and when he was being considered for tenure.) [I have heard similar stories from friends within the medical community - where you went *can* have a big impact on the jobs you are even considered for.]

This is true on the slightly smaller scale too. The Community College my eldest is attending has an outstanding reputation with local 4 year schools, but the classes there are much more challenging, and, yes, much harder to get as high a grade in than another 2 year college (also local) - a 4.0 GPA from the other college really doesn't mean as much as a 3.5 from the better school... and the classes from the less rigorous school do not transfer well to the UW - so a student would have to retake a number of key classes for most science majors.

Now, you are right that high price doesn't necessarily mean a better school... and each school, however prestigious, has its areas of relative strength and weakness.

I feel strongly, as I ranted on about on the other board, that this is not a decision which should be made on purely monetary grounds. the atmosphere, the outside-of-class learning and career opportunities, the amount and quality of instructional support, the reputation of the specific department, its record placing students with the desired major in either jobs or graduate schools - if one is considering doing a 2 year school and then transferring, make 100% sure that the courses *will* transfer! Not all Chem 140's are created equal! See what the 4 year school folks (actual professors and other members of the major department) think of the 2 year school being considered - find the success statistics for previous transfers from that school... weigh *all* the significant costs before ruling something in or out based on price tag!

There is not a standard checklist for what makes a school a good match - the weighting is different for each student... but the process of really examining all the aspects is essential, imho, in every case.

[Caroline]

Ds plans to be a civil engineer so he will hopefully make pretty good money. He plans to graduate in four years and then live simply to get everything paid back ASAP. But $74,000 in loans?! It seems like too much.

How much were your college loans and how long did it take to pay them back? Mine were $1,500 and I paid it back my first year of teaching.

How much is too much?

This $74k, does it include getting a masters degree? I ask because most civil engineering positions require a masters degree these days. Of course, engineering grad school is pretty easy to get funded, and any student loans would probably be deferred during grad school.

Just something else to add into the mix.

Neither DH nor I had college loans. We went to Virginia Tech for undergraduate school. I actually had some of the top materials science graduate programs calling me unsolicited when it was time to choose a graduate school. So it isn't all in a big name school. (Well, VA Tech is pretty highly respected in engineering circles, although it is not MIT.)

[Puma Mom]

This $74k, does it include getting a masters degree? I ask because most civil engineering positions require a masters degree these days. Of course, engineering grad school is pretty easy to get funded, and any student loans would probably be deferred during grad school.

Just something else to add into the mix.

Neither DH nor I had college loans. We went to Virginia Tech for undergraduate school. I actually had some of the top materials science graduate programs calling me unsolicited when it was time to choose a graduate school. So it isn't all in a big name school. (Well, VA Tech is pretty highly respected in engineering circles, although it is not MIT.)I have a Civil Engr. degree from VA Tech (Go Hokies!), and I didn't know too many people in my jobs that had master's degrees. It probably depends on what exactly you end up doing with the degree. Getting the professional engineering license was a much bigger deal for the work I was doing. Just wanted to give another perspective.

Our oldest will be majoring in engineering at VA Tech in the fall. We have said we would pay half of his college, and he would have to come up with the rest. He will have his half for freshman year, and plans to participate in the Co-Op program after that. Co-Op programs, if you're not familiar, connect students with employers for semester-long jobs that pertain to their majors. The student gets paid, as well as valuable work experience.

We will highly discourage our dc incurring large student loans. We'd rather they co-op or sit out a year or a semester and work than graduate with a huge loan hanging over their heads.

[mom2abcd]

This $74k, does it include getting a masters degree? I ask because most civil engineering positions require a masters degree these days. Of course, engineering grad school is pretty easy to get funded, and any student loans would probably be deferred during grad school.



No, this estimate does not include getting a Master's Degree. Cost for the small (2,000 students) private university is $36,000 or so a year and he has been offered about half that in merit scholarships, grants, etc. It includes work study for about the number of hours he'd probably work. (I don't know how some of you work 40-50 hours a week while going to college full-time. I know a college girl who can do homework while manning the phone at a music conservatory so I guess those type of hours would be feasible with that type of job.)

We have been serving in the ministry for twenty-one years and have only some retirement savings. No debt (at this point), but no savings. Dh is also planning to pursue his dream of further studies (2 plus years with very little income... we will be going into debt.) We cannot help ds except for some travel expenses, finding books at campusi.com, etc. We will also be in student housing and there will literally be no room for him so living with us is out, too.)

I'm glad to hear so many say this is not the norm. Hopefully the private college he really wants to attend will offer a better package. We did put some public colleges down on the FAFSA and he actually applied to one today. We're late in the process, though, and it may end up costing the same. (We've heard this time and time again-- private colleges usually have more money to offer and their packages often come back with a better offer than public colleges.)

There's always the free work colleges... like the College of the Ozarks. Unfortuantely, we haven't found one that offers an engineering degree.

Thanks for the input, friends.

Are there others who have dc in college now?