So are we doing the wrong thing?

[choirfarm]

I've been reading the college thread with interest. I guess I have always assumed my children will all go to college and get a degree, but even my grandparents had a college degree and I guess I just assumed they did farther back as well. We have saved for college for these children since they were born and now they all have 529 plans. We almost have enough in the boys accounts to pay for Baylor all 4 years (they are 13, and 11) and enough in the 6yo account to pay for half. The money has been automatically deducted since they were babies. It is a given in our house. Is that wrong? My oldest just recently took the ACT as a 7th grader as part of the Duke program and did really well, could possibly get into Baylor with it, but realistically into junior college at this stage. I guess, to me, college is the ultimate goal with med school, law school, master's program or whatever after that... IS that wrong?
Christine

[Plaid Dad]

Of course not. I haven't followed all of the college thread, but there is nothing at all wrong with wanting your dc to go to college. The point of the thread, I think, is that college is not right for all children and it is not always the ticket to (financial) success that some parents assume.

[JuJuBee]

My oldest just recently took the ACT as a 7th grader as part of the Duke program


Aside: My oldest is in the Duke TIP program, and will be going to their summer camp in June!

Our aim is, insofar as it depends on us, to make admission to a good university possible for my children. They may not choose it, but I am not going to close that door for them. We may not like it, but the reality is that things like degrees and IQ do impact life outcome, statistically speaking. I don't play the odds on my children being the exception; though if they are, that is wonderful. I wouldn't pressure my children to go to college if they had a clearly defined path that lead them elsewhere, but the value of my liberal arts undergraduate education, and even the Master's degree that we're still paying for, is priceless to me, even though I'm 'just' a SAHM. I think spending a period of your life continuing your studies could not be a bad thing.

[Karen sn]

Absolutely not at all.
It's assumed here too.

"When you go to college [dd] you will get to live in a dorm with other kids and attend classes that study [whatever amazing thing we are doing, looking at, wondering about, or studying at that exact moment]."

The thing is - we should have a plan, an option to experience it.
Or not.

I would never force her. And I don't think I would be entirely disappointed if she didn't - AS LONG AS she were studying or doing something else "productive".

[GVA]

Good Lord willing, my children are going to go to college. We don't have a ton saved, but they're smart cookies and the college I work for is a decent one. There are good ones within commuting distance if they need to live at home to save $.

As a part-time community college professor myself, I know the benefits intellectually of going to college and how it prepares one for a good job in certain fields. For every story of someone who is doing fine without college, I can tell you ten stories of people were struggled without college. They're in my classes because they can't get promoted, change jobs, or rise above entry-level work without a degree. Frankly if you read the statistics (and I see them in our college literature), the modern economy definitely favors those who have college degrees. Also, granted this is the DC area, but there are many employers here who routinely cull out resumes of people without degrees even if they have the experience.

So no, college is not for everyone, but I would head that way unless there is a very good reason for not doing that.

[Tracey in TX]

College is as expected as eating breakfast in the morning. It's NOT an option.
DD (8) wanted to irritate DH -said she wasn't going to college. Thought he would have a breakdown. He let her spend the day learning to be a waitress and maid b/c there aren't a whole lot of careers available to those who choose not to attend university.

While we have five kiddos, we will probably afford only 50-75% of college costs. Totally envy the 100% Baylor tuition saved;) (DD (10) has boys convinced they need to attend Air Force Academy so she gets their funds to attend Northwestern or Princeton. LOL)

[Danestress]

Buck up! I am assuming that maybe another thread has caused you to post this. You and your DH have been saving money all this time, and you can't let total strangers on a board undermine your confidence in the decisions you have made. Are you seriously thinking it might be wrong? Has something convicted you of that?

DH and I are like you - we just assume our children will go to college and probably to graduate schools as well. I wouldn't limit them to one (what if your child really hates Baylor?) and if I had a child who truly didn't want to go to college, I guess I would adjust. But I tend to think that if one doesn't want to go, the one who goes to grad school will use that 529 money anyway, so no problem. In any case, the lovely women here who have attitudes different from mine (those who aren't quite as set on college as the goal and those who want their kids to go but don't think it's the parents' responsibility to pay for that) have taught me many things and made me think hard about my prejudices and presumptions. I love that we can have those conversations, and that most of us try to have open minds and hearts for each other. But so far, no one has made me start to use our college savings as beer money:)

[KristineIN]

I think it's great that you all are thinking that way, just remember, just because a child starts college, doesn't mean that they will finish. My dh had all of his college tuition paid for and and it was a LOT of money just wasted. He went for about two and a half years and did not really get anywhere. He is a successful self employed contractor and is very happy. We aren't rich, but that's not what life is about for us. I do have a college degree, don't use it, but know that if anything happens to dh, I have it to fall back on.

Kristine

[Jenny in Atl]

Wow, I wish I was as healthy financially (college funds!). College is very much the door I hope both of mine will choose. At this point I have not a clue as to how we will pay for it, but we will find a way.

[LNC]

Sounds great to me! I'm a Baylor grad :)

[Mrs. H.]

We assume all our dc will go to college as well, it is discussed, and dh has been brainwashing them to 'think medical school' since they were babies, lol.

Dh was the first person to graduate from not only college in his family, but law school as well. However, he doesn't want any of our children to be lawyers...hmm.

We think it's fine to want your children to go to college, and it's also fine to assume it's a given, save up money for it, etc. However, our love and happiness with our children isn't tied up into whether or not they go to college, and we have NO money saved up for them to go. They will work and pay their own way through school, hopefully with scholarships, just like dh and I did. Going to college on Mom and Dad's dime doesn't make it nearly as "real" as having to work for it yourself, in our opinion. We will help our children in other ways, however.

[OnTheBrink]

It's expected my kids will go to college. My son is already there and I expect my dd to attend as well. It doesn't matter to me what kind of college (Bible college, private Christian or public), but I do expect them to go and finish. If they choose some other path in life, they need to make sure they can support themselves in it and not live at home forever.

[Doran]

I've been reading the college thread with interest. I guess I have always assumed my children will all go to college and get a degree, but even my grandparents had a college degree and I guess I just assumed they did farther back as well. We have saved for college for these children since they were born and now they all have 529 plans. We almost have enough in the boys accounts to pay for Baylor all 4 years (they are 13, and 11) and enough in the 6yo account to pay for half. The money has been automatically deducted since they were babies. It is a given in our house. Is that wrong? My oldest just recently took the ACT as a 7th grader as part of the Duke program and did really well, could possibly get into Baylor with it, but realistically into junior college at this stage. I guess, to me, college is the ultimate goal with med school, law school, master's program or whatever after that... IS that wrong?
Christine


You can't be serious?! I'm not being snarky, and not meaning to offend you in any way. But, you can't honestly think you are WRONG to have planned for your kids' college attendance. Of course it's not wrong! It's wise. It's perfectly understandable. It's great!

I think we have to be careful not to live our childrens' lives for them. There may be parents like you who have saved and planned only to find that their children are miserable with the idea of attending collge, or who are doing very poorly in college. At that point, I think it would be wrong to not reassess your goals. But, for now, you're all good. :001_smile:




Doran

[choirfarm]

DH and I are like you - we just assume our children will go to college and probably to graduate schools as well. I wouldn't limit them to one (what if your child really hates Baylor?) :)


Grin..no they don't have to go to Baylor. It is just the most expensive option we would entertain. If they want to go to Yale or Stanford or other WAY too expensive school, they have to fund the excess. That is one reason we went the 529 plan, so that if child 1 went to A&M, but child 2 decided to do Baylor and med school like his dad, he could. We would just move the money around to the child who needs it.

[choirfarm]

Going to college on Mom and Dad's dime doesn't make it nearly as "real" as having to work for it yourself, in our opinion. We will help our children in other ways, however.

There I have to disagree. I did have summer jobs in high school, but my parents refused to let me work during the school year. They said that being a student was my full time job and they wanted me in extra-curricular. It paid off as I paid for half of the cost of Baylor my first 3 years and the total cost the last year and a half with scholarships. Likewise, my husband's family paid his way through college and med school, but he had full scholarships the last few years at Baylor as well (I think it was Phi Beta Kappa scholarship or something) We are eternally grateful that our parents provided for it, so we could graduate without any debt. So dh has made it a priority, the minute I got pregnant to start saving. We have always been committed to living debt free as well. My oldest is just like his dad. He has set up a money account where he tracks his savings account and keeps track of extra chore money, b-day money and such.

[Margaret in CO]

Just a heads-up to you savers--any money in the child's name must be spent down the first year, 100%. So, if you're thinking,: he's got 40,000, that'll be 10,000 a year. Not so. They figure that money is available all the FIRST year. And any such funds must be moved before the child's junior year of high school or it counts! Just though I'd mention it!

[LG Gone Wild]

My parents assumed I would go because they are Asian and Jewish. I mean, we people just go to college and become doctors or accountants. I never wanted to go because I didn't know what I was supposed to be doing there. It was a bit of a disaster and I flunked out.

It is great that you have that financial door open to your kids should they want to pursue a higher education. Just don't push it. Perhaps they would like a year or two to strike it out on their own before going to college.

[pixelroper]

I too have found the long threads difficult to understand. It really does require reading the whole thing- and most of what is said is opinion.

Specifically it was started with a "Why would parents tell their children college is meaningless?" It ended up with specific/general defenses for or against. It is all POV. Congrats on such careful planning!

[momtolgd]

dh has been brainwashing them to 'think medical school' since they were babies, lol.


LOL, glad to know my DH is not the only one who does this...he's got both of our older kids saying they want to be doctors...and he actually has me seriously considering going to nursing school (one of the things I always wanted to do but didn't.)

We do expect that our children will all go to college, and our plan is to have them prepared for that. Of course that will ultimately be their decision to make, but we plan on them all going.

[choirfarm]

Just a heads-up to you savers--any money in the child's name must be spent down the first year, 100%. So, if you're thinking,: he's got 40,000, that'll be 10,000 a year. Not so. They figure that money is available all the FIRST year. And any such funds must be moved before the child's junior year of high school or it counts! Just though I'd mention it!

??? You have completely lost me. Are you saying that 100 percent of the 529 plan must be used...that isn't true. In fact, you can only withdraw what you actually spent. I don't understand what you are saying....

Christine

[Margaret in CO]

I don't know how 529 plans work, but if you have regular savings accounts, the school assumes that ALL of that money is available the first year. SO, if you have 40,000 saved (just grabbing a number) that money would be ALL used the first year--thus making the student not eligible for any lower income scholarships. Savings in mom and dad's names, or in younger children's names is not counted the same way. Younger children's accounts aren't counted and mom and dad can save some of theirs. When you see the form from the school, Suzy would have "available" 40,000 that first year, not 10,000 for 4 years. Did that make any more sense? I'm not explaining very well... We didn't use 529 plans as Hillsdale won't accept them and my second is not paying tuition at all. (well, except for possibly her life in a few years!!!)

[Call Me Cordelia]

Definitely. Please take everything you've saved and send it to me.

[choirfarm]

It doesn't matter... we won't be eligible for any need based scholarships anyway. This is part of the reason we have saved so diligently. We figure that unless he is a National Merit scholar or gets another academic type scholarship, we will be paying the entire amount wherever he/she goes. We won't ever qualify for financial aid on a need based amount, nor should we. We aren't planning on social security either. It will probably be bankrupt by the time we retire. Plus dh wants to do medical missions full time when he retires which will be about the time my youngest starts college. So we consistently save A LOT of our income for retirement and college and one wedding (one girl) so that he can do full time medical missions at 55. We don't have cable, kids don't have cell phones or any of the computer gaming stuff. We grow our own food in a garden, so my grocery bill isn't bad. My kids are in a habit of saying, "Do you have a coupon for that or is it on sale?" I only buy clothes when they are on clearance at the end of the season for the next year.
Christine

I don't know how 529 plans work, but if you have regular savings accounts, the school assumes that ALL of that money is available the first year. SO, if you have 40,000 saved (just grabbing a number) that money would be ALL used the first year--thus making the student not eligible for any lower income scholarships. Savings in mom and dad's names, or in younger children's names is not counted the same way. Younger children's accounts aren't counted and mom and dad can save some of theirs. When you see the form from the school, Suzy would have "available" 40,000 that first year, not 10,000 for 4 years. Did that make any more sense? I'm not explaining very well... We didn't use 529 plans as Hillsdale won't accept them and my second is not paying tuition at all. (well, except for possibly her life in a few years!!!)

[Sahamamama]

My husband is almost 38 years old, and this June, Lord willing, he will graduate from college with a bachelor's degree -- more than 20 years after he started. Back in his younger days, by his own admission, he was a spoiled brat who goofed off, skipped classes, and got kicked out of college. Now, with a wife and three babies, a mortgage, a dead-end job, and bills to pay, he has regrets.

But he also has determination, and a perspective on the value of the degree. Do you know how many jobs he is shut out of, simply because he has no degree? All his years of experience in his field (medical/technical) are nice, but only go so far. Hopefully, this degree will make a difference. His employer has already said that when his degree is done, he gets a new job title and a raise. We'll see, but to answer your question, YES! -- encourage your children not only to GO to college, but to WORK while they're there, and to make the most of the opportunity.

I would further add, that the degree itself is important, but the major chosen is crucial, too, in terms of income potential. I majored in social work, of all things, then got a masters degree in Bible -- ha ha. I am not the most employable of all people. Encourage your children to choose their careers/majors wisely, even, as JuJuBee said, your daughters become "only" stay-at-home-mothers. I am home with our three girls and have no regrets about getting those two degrees, although in my vulnerable moments I wonder what I would EVER do without David and how I would make a living with the degrees I do have. Oh well, I'll cross that bridge if I come to it.

[Mrs Mungo]

I've been reading the college thread with interest. I guess I have always assumed my children will all go to college and get a degree, but even my grandparents had a college degree and I guess I just assumed they did farther back as well. We have saved for college for these children since they were born and now they all have 529 plans. We almost have enough in the boys accounts to pay for Baylor all 4 years (they are 13, and 11) and enough in the 6yo account to pay for half. The money has been automatically deducted since they were babies. It is a given in our house. Is that wrong? My oldest just recently took the ACT as a 7th grader as part of the Duke program and did really well, could possibly get into Baylor with it, but realistically into junior college at this stage. I guess, to me, college is the ultimate goal with med school, law school, master's program or whatever after that... IS that wrong?
Christine

No, you aren't wrong for what you are doing for your family and your kids. It's *never* wrong to prepare your kids for college. It's never wrong to save money to help them with college. It's never wrong to encourage your children to pursue their goals. The only thing I think is wrong is when parents push children to pursue the parent's unfulfilled dreams.

[unsinkable]

Oh, dear...how can I put this kindly?

You're smart and driven enough to attend Baylor, graduate, marry and stay married, have a couple kids and homeschool them, save thousands of dollars for the kids' future educations...

but you let a thread on a message board bother you to the extent that you question the idea that you want your kids to go to college?

Come on. Really. Don't be silly.

[LG Gone Wild]

Oh, dear...how can I put this kindly?

You're smart and driven enough to attend Baylor, graduate, marry and stay married, have a couple kids and homeschool them, save thousands of dollars for the kids' future educations...

but you let a thread on a message board bother you to the extent that you question the idea that you want your kids to go to college?

Come on. Really. Don't be silly.


;)

[Janet in WA]

I'm not in a position to say what's right and what's wrong where college is concerned, but college has been in our expectations for our sons from the time they were born too. They might have chosen otherwise (they didn't -- all went to college), but WE weren't going to operate on any other plan until they made other plans themselves.

[Danestress]

Well, Baylor is a great college and they could do worse.

I assumed you wouldn't *make* them go there, but honestly I am struggling for what it is that you think you might be doing "wrong." Are you honestly saying that you are struggling with whether you might be doing the wrong thing or was your question rhetorical? Because it seems like you feel very right about what you are doing.

[Colleen]

College is as expected as eating breakfast in the morning. It's NOT an option.

I'm flummoxed when people say this. How does one force an 18 or 20 year old person to attend college if s/he is not in agreement with the plan? Do you go so far as to disown a child, or...? I'm asking in all honesty.

DD (8) wanted to irritate DH -said she wasn't going to college. Thought he would have a breakdown. He let her spend the day learning to be a waitress and maid b/c there aren't a whole lot of careers available to those who choose not to attend university.

Well...that's not true, actually. There are a plethora of careers available, though they might not be what you envision for your child. Even apprentices in many trades earn far more than a slew of folks with four-year degrees.

[Colleen]

Like Dana, I'm not clear as to what you're after here. It feels to me ~ and I could very well be misunderstanding ~ that you essentially wanted to share your reality. And that's great ~ share away! But it's quite clear that you and your husband have been pursuing this plan for years; are in agreement with one another about the plan; and are content with your decision.

If, hypothetically, you received a hundred replies urging you to jump ship and change directions altogether, would you? Of course not. If we all said, "Yes, you're doing the wrong thing!", you'd keep doing what you're doing. Because you long ago decided it was the right thing. So what, if anything, are you really asking?

[Robin in Tx]

That's exactly how we feel, too. There are plenty of options for those who don't want to go to college, but those options will still be there even if the student does finish college first. It doesn't work the same vice versa - the options that are available to the college graduate are not available to the non-graduate. To me, a college degree equates freedom - the freedom to pursue any and all opportunities, and the freedom to be flexible. With community college available for dual credit and local colleges available to finish the last two years out, why wouldn't I encourage, even plan for, my student to make this investment now?

BTW, she'd love to go to Baylor, too, but it's going to take a scholarship to make that happen! LOL

Roboin

[cin]

My husband is almost 38 years old, and this June, Lord willing, he will graduate from college with a bachelor's degree -- more than 20 years after he started. Back in his younger days, by his own admission, he was a spoiled brat who goofed off, skipped classes, and got kicked out of college. Now, with a wife and three babies, a mortgage, a dead-end job, and bills to pay, he has regrets.

But he also has determination, and a perspective on the value of the degree. Do you know how many jobs he is shut out of, simply because he has no degree?


CONGRATULATIONS to you DH, and KUDOS for seeing what is really important; Caring for his family.

DH is sort of in the same boat. He has an Associates Degree in computers, and it has taken him 20 years to finally get to a place where he is earning what he deserves. He still will probably never get into management, but his skills and expertise have FINALLY paid off. He was a contractor for P&G for 15 years....helping to create their computer sytem standards, but never good enough to be hired. Fortunately, Kroger saw what he did, liked it and hired him...wooed him actually. I am so proud of him!

Cindy

[Dayle in Guatemala]

you all value education so much that you've planned for it and had the means to pay for it. I say, good for you!!!!

It's not so much, to me, that I don't want them to go to college. I really really really do. I love and value education. I had the time of my life in college and it was tremendous for me. But, I do have a problem with parents who put their expectation on their children even when it isn't in the child's heart or best interest to go. I watched so many of my classmates waste their time and money and never really find direction until after they either dropped out, or were asked to leave because of poor grades. It was not pretty.

I think you should be proud. I would be, that you've given such a legacy to your dc.