Help Me figure out math

[choirfarm]

I'm struggling with what to do for next year for math... My concern is with my 2 oldest boys. My oldest is VERY bright and qualified for the DUKE tip program and scored well on the ACT last month. He is in 7th grade. I took him out of school after 3rd grade and got Saxon 54, because that is what they used in school. He finished it in record time. For 5th grade we did Saxon 65, but we both hated it. In fact for both 54 and 65 we skipped half the book because I knew he already knew the material, I would give him the test, he would make 100 or miss one and we would go on without actually doing the material. So...in January we were finished and so we switched to Singapore. I went ahead and started with 3B and we did 3B all the way to 6B from February of his 5th grade year to the end of his 6th grade year. So.... this year for 7th after much agonizing I decided to go with Teaching Textbooks Algebra. I got the Singapore NSM to supplement it, but that was a disaster. Neither he nor I could figure out that book and we ditched it after the first chapter. TT has gone pretty well. He is only a little over halfway through it, however. There was a time when the lessons were taking him forever... well, actually probably standard time for an Algebra lesson...a little over an hour. But he was used to lessons taking him 20 to 30 minutes. So we broke up the lessons over 2 days for a while. But now he is doing one lesson a day. We also spent a month doing ALEX instead of TT to catchi him up on a couple of skills that he had missed with Singapore like graphing (1, 3). He did the 8th grade and almost finished it before the month was up. He also did ACT prep math for a week before he took it. So that is why he is only on 60 right now. Now he is still ahead because he is only a 7th grader so I'm not concerned with his not finishing, but... I have no idea what to do for next year. Also, people keep talking about TT not being rigorous enough so maybe I should supplement, but with what??? I also want something I can use with my younger son. So I finish TT Algebra and then..... what? Do a supplement Algebra? Go on to Geometry?? There is a possibility of his going to public high school in 9th grade, so maybe I should just stick with Algebra since the honors kids take geometry in 9th grade....

Then there is my 5th grader who hates math and thinks he isn't good with it. His standardized scores in math were in the 40th percentile when I took him out of ps, but last go around they were in the 80th. I did a hodgepodge for 2nd grade. Saxon for 3rd. Saxon 54 for 4th which he HATED!!!! We made it about halfway through before we switched to Horizons which he has enjoyed. he is currently in Horizons 5, which is taking us forever!!! He is on lesson 110 of 180. I feel like we will never finish... Sometime he figures out the riddles and fills in the answer and doesn't actually work the problems... TT would be a good fit for him because he isn't math minded and doesn't intuitively see math like my oldest does. That said, he is a little above average, but thinks he is slow and stupid compared to his brother. I've considered switching to TT 7 for him, he has been watching his older brother's Algebra and likes it.. So, I don't know what to do for next year. I've heard Chalk Dust is good and rigerous, but I don't think my younger boy could do it so I hate to spend over 400 dollars for just one child and then 200 dollars on somehting else for another!!! Help

Christine

[choirfarm]

This was already on page 3!!! Anyone???
Christine

[Gretchen in NJ]

From what I have been told, Horizons is just a more colorful Saxon. Have you tried R&S Math for your younger son?

Gretchen

[AngieW in Texas]

I like Jacobs Algebra. My 12yo was intimidated by it after years of Singapore, so she is also working through Kinetic books Algebra. Kinetic Books is pretty much self-teaching, like TT, but is a lot more rigorous. It doesn't have the kind of support that TT has though. There is no solution manual, just an answer key. Jacobs also has just an answer key. I haven't had any problems with that, but I know that some might.

I also like Jacobs Geometry. My oldest is using it this year and will probably use Foerster's for Algebra II next year, because that's what Harold Jacobs recommends as a followup program.

Has your youngest tried Singapore Math? Since you already have it, it might be worth a shot.

[Heather in VA]

I love VideoText Algebra. It will cover Algebra 1 and 2. Singapore would be a good choice I think for your younger.

[choirfarm]

Maybe I'll get it back out, but it was WAY too abstract for my younger boy when I tried it before. The other day in Horizon they were supposed to borrow and rename a fraction: 7 2/8 = 6 10/8. He couldn't get it. To me it was easy. Eventually after a lot of paper and pencil with me showing him that 1 can be 3/3, 2/2, 6/6 or whatever and you just add it to the other number after you borrow it... See that sounds so confusing. I just KNOW math, but have NO idea how to explain it. My oldest just teaches himself and completely understands my shorthand if he has a problem. I probably should have cut out various fraction circles or something and had him play with them. He seems to need hands on or something. My kindergartener is currently doing Singapore 1A and doing well. I'm just not sure the abstract nature of it will work well for that middle child. I'm just having a REALLY hard time doing what is best for 3 VERY different children. There isn't enough of me to go around. Things are starting to fall through the cracks.
Christine

[Gretchen in NJ]

Children sometimes struggle with fractions at this point. You were correct in thinking that you son might need a visual aid. Visual aids do not have to be complicated.
You could use you lunch one day or a few pieces of fruit. Evenly sliced (divided) sandwiches come to mind. Also, baking in the kitchen might help. You could double a recipe or cut one in half.
Enchanted Learning also has a few good visual worksheets on reducing and equivalent fractions.

How about asking your older son to teach a concept to the younger? This would benfit both students. IMHO you really don't know a concept well unless you are able to explain it to others.

Gretchen

[liz]

Well, maybe I should start with my girls. They loved Saxon. (Both are now severalyears past grade 12 and STILL talk positively about it!)

My boys.... well, around grade 5 or 6 I realized that Saxon just didn't work for him. (He's also very bright in math, like your son.) Saxon was just SO repetitious -- it put him to sleep so he got things endlessly wrong. I finally switched him to Singapore, and he did grades 4-6 in about 1 1/2 years. Then I moved him to New Math Counts (because I'd heard the more advanced Singapore math problem needed a teacher, and I couldn't be that!). He completed the first 3 books in 2 years. (So at the end of grade 10 he finished the 3rd book.) (By the way, he did ALL his math on his own. I didn't teach him anything from about grade 3!) His SAT math scores have been GREAT! He's now in school for grade 11 and is tutoring the class!

Our younger son is also good in math, but very visual. He loved the colorfulness of A Beka (I've always used that for the first few years), but then I switched him. This year we are doing R&S with Singapore. Still trying to decide what to do for next year. R&S isn't viisually appealing, but it's a great program. (My older girls were helping school him several days and were SO impressed with the mental math he did in that program. They kept saying, "Daniel is SO smart, Mom!!!)

Anyway, just my experience...........

[GailV]

The other day in Horizon they were supposed to borrow and rename a fraction: 7 2/8 = 6 10/8. He couldn't get it. To me it was easy. Eventually after a lot of paper and pencil with me showing him that 1 can be 3/3, 2/2, 6/6 or whatever and you just add it to the other number after you borrow it... See that sounds so confusing. I just KNOW math, but have NO idea how to explain it.


This sounds so much like my 12yo dd. I can instantly, intuitively see what to do with the fractions, but had no clue how to explain it in words she'd understand. I eventually got Key to Fractions, and she feels so much more confident after going through it. She said the Key to Fractions series went through so incrementally that it was easy to understand. Plus it was fairly inexpensive.

I was thinking about using TT pre-Algebra for her, but was searching various threads for reviews of Algebra programs. She sounds like your 5th grader -- although her math scores are okay (80th percentile) she hates it and considers herself poor at math -- she thinks she's "slow and stupid" as you said. I'm thinking I may need to give up my fantasy of having my kids in a rigorous program and go with something that encourages her.