Has anyone here used Touch Math ?

[TracyR]

I love the concept and we've used some of the downloadable worksheets off their website . And it really works well with my daughters. But its so expensive . I've seen some of the kits on Ebay . Does anyone know of any other places to look for this program used other then Ebay ? And alot of the times not even Ebay carries it .

Does anyone else here use it , have used it ?
Here is the link for those of you who are not familiar with the program
www.touchmath.com (http://www.touchmath.com)

[hsmom]

My ds had a teacher teach him this in ps. It worked for him, but he became very dependent on the touch points and could not break away from it to do the math without the touch points.

We are now using a different approach and I am trying to re-teach him to do math with out it.

[TracyR]

Yeah . I was wondering about that . If they began to rely on the touch points . Thank you for your reply . I'll just stick with my orignial idea and use Christian Light's math then .

[hsmom]

Your welcome.

[5wolfcubs]

I used it w/ my oldest who still hadn't memorized her addition & subtraction facts -- I bought the oh, so expensive teacher's kits for those and then just the workbooks for multiplication & division. They were worth it for her. She is 13 now, still math-phobic and on occasion still uses the points. In fact, even last year I had the little mini-poster hanging above her desk, just in case she wanted it. I don't know that she ever used it, she hasn't asked where I put it anyway!

In a sense it is no different then using phonics for sounding out a word or your fingers to add/subtract. Or writing out a math problem because you can't compute it in your head or writing out a word to see if it looks "right." I suppose, ideally, no one would have to do these by the time they are 13 or 35...but most of us probably do make use of these strategies. I actually like it better than MUS in the sense that the child always has the points, unlike the blocks. Although, my two who use MUS don't even need the blocks (they didn't need TouchMath either).

Do they still sell the workbooks? You could try those. You could simply dot the tricky numbers in CLE. I've heard wonderful things about their math!

Okay, I've been thinking about this a little more. If your child struggles w/ math facts, I'd suggest picking a single strategy (be it manipulatives, TouchPoints, or something else) and then add daily oral (or written) fact review. Using lot of different methods over a short period of time (even a year for a young child) can be confusing also. So pick one and go forward. Math facts take time (years!) for some children. :)

[TracyR]

Thanks for the review . I may just use the concept with CLE math . I know Touch Math has lots of worksheets that you can copy off their site . I could use those for practice too .
They do sell the workbooks but $53 -$80 for 4 workbooks is mighty steep for us when I can get CLE math for MUCH less and just use the concept . Thanks :>)

[Robin Hood]

I love touch math. The company will send you a dvd and enought materials to get you started for free, and all you have to return is the dvd. My 9yo dd struggles and this was a great help to her. She herself doesn't want to be dependent on it and only uses it to get her thinking. Many times it helps her focus and she comes up with the answer before she finishes. It has taken the pressure off her. The dvd will show you how to keep your kids from being dependent and there is no need to buy all that stuff. It is not a curriculum, it is an aid. Once you figure out how it works, you can use it with your own curriculum. you can even google it and there are websites that will give you step by step instruction if you don't want to contact the comany. I didn't bookmark them. Sorry

[oakmom]

Many students get mixed up and forget how many dots the numbers should have as they are somewhat randomly placed. For example, why does the number 4 have 4 dots, instead of 5? Why does the 9 have 9 dots?

I also don't think this program helps students develp number sense. I've found they get overly dependent on counting 9 dots to add 9 to a number and this is really not a fast way to add and there is a lot more chace of making a mistake.

There are many other programs like Singapore, Right Start, etc. that really help students develop many great strategies for thinking about numbers that help them to be fast and accurate. For example, a good strategy for adding 9 might be add 10 and subtract 1. This method is not only fast, but there is less room for error.

[TracyR]

Yes. I've tried Singapore math and Calvert math with my 2nd daughter and its just too many strategies for her . My daughter does have a receptive delay so it takes her a little longer to understand things . Add too many different ways and her head is ready to explode . I can't tell you how many tears have been shed because I've shown her different ways to come up with the answer and she just goes into hysterics . Calvert teaches math using different strategies as well and she just breaks down . None of the strategies seem to help her at all . She starts to cry and tells me how stupid she is . I definitley don't want that for her. I want her to be confident in herself with math . She just wants to know there is one way to come up with the answer and not have to think if she adds 10 and subtracts 1 she'll get her answer . Now that works well with my oldest who is good with math .

My 2nd daughter just wants to know that 2+2=4 and moves on . Math just doesn't come easy for her .

[5wolfcubs]

Many students get mixed up and forget how many dots the numbers should have as they are somewhat randomly placed. For example, why does the number 4 have 4 dots, instead of 5? Why does the 9 have 9 dots?

I've read slightly different theories/drawings of this -- but check out
Math Magic Numerals (http://wme.cs.kent.edu/kimpton/int_symbols.html?index=/kimpton/int_index.html&indexname=back+to+module)
and
Fun with Numbers (http://www.orthohelp.com/number.htm)

Cool, eh?

TracyR -- my oldest sounds a lot like your 2nd dd (frustration, tears, lack of understanding, etc). My next two seem to instinctively grasp concepts, memorize effortlessly, and love math. They enjoy using tricks & strategies & mental math. They also think I should solve each of their math problems instead of consulting the teacher's answer key.
:lol: <-- That's me shaking my head and saying "no way!" Anyway, just wanted to let you know that I can empathize! Have you looked at Right Start (abacus) or Math-U-See (blocks)?

[Robin Hood]

Many students get mixed up and forget how many dots the numbers should have as they are somewhat randomly placed. For example, why does the number 4 have 4 dots, instead of 5? Why does the 9 have 9 dots?

I also don't think this program helps students develp number sense. I've found they get overly dependent on counting 9 dots to add 9 to a number and this is really not a fast way to add and there is a lot more chace of making a mistake.

There are many other programs like Singapore, Right Start, etc. that really help students develop many great strategies for thinking about numbers that help them to be fast and accurate. For example, a good strategy for adding 9 might be add 10 and subtract 1. This method is not only fast, but there is less room for error.

Oakmom, have you actually tried this on numerous students? I am not familiar with your background and wondered if you were a teacher.

I really love the Touch Math. It doesn't have to be for everybody. It is a total kinesthetic approach to math. I have called TM twice because it was unclear to me weather or not it is a currriculum or and aid. Math curriculum is expensive enough without spending even twice the amount on an aid to math.

My dd thinks outside the box. She gets concepts and in fact helps her younger sister understand. Word problems come easy for her. One time and she has it. That said, she has some sort of disability that prevents her from being quick. Numbers flood her head in a 52 card pick sort of way and the intense work of finding the the right one in her picture oriented thinking, shuts her down.

She has all the strategies memorized, but when actually faced with a problem, she has a flood of strategies enter her brain, she says them all herself, picks the appropriate one and then the flood of numbers comes followed by break down and tears or just plain shutting off. Logic isn't always the strategy that works for her. It doesn't matter that the 4 has for dots instead of 5, it matters that there are 4 dots and that you count them the same every time. In that manner, it extends itself to subtraction, multiplication and division. That's the logic of it for some kids and it works. Half way through the counting my dd says out loud, "Oh, I know this." and she completes her math now in record time, (for her) abandoning the TM aid. It helps her through the flood, like a raft. As to the 9's, for little ones like mine, she likes that you count each dot twice and then touch the nose. That kind of thinking is right up her alley. I think it's stupid, but her confidence has grown because she has been given a useful tool that helps her work through "the flood".

We've done Saxon, we've done MUS, we've done a series of dept store workbooks. She gets it. We've decided to stay with MUS and use Touch Math as an aid to get the answers. The relationship of numbers to reality is no problem for her.

As to your statement that there is more chance of making a mistake with TouchMath, there is a chance of making mistakes with all math, that is why I teach my kids to go back and proof each problem before they are done, just like I was taught in school and the way that Saxon and MUS teach. Proof your work.

I am not challening you. My dd has challenged me to move outside the box to find a way for her to do math. It works.

[TracyR]

I haven't tried Math U See with her yet. This is one math program I haven't used . I'm not sure if the blocks would help her or not . They did when I used them with her oldest sister when we used BJU math and she understood this . I've used manipulatives with my 2nd daughter and it helps a little but not a whole lot like it did with big sis .
I can't rule out MUS though . I'll have to look into it . But right now we're using the concept and its helping . As long as I stick with one way to get to the problem she does fine .

Thank you for all of your advice :>)